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Station access conversation

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May 14, 2015 brzi95 link
May 14, 2015 brzi95 link
Interesting right?
May 14, 2015 Pizzasgood link
Not really, no. All that's happening here is that you think that the various ways you help TGFT should be enough for them to grant you keys to the stations they conquer, without you needing to help them conquer the stations. TGFT disagrees with that stance. What is interesting about that? Just boring politics.

Then there's the stuff about TGFT "going behind your back" and nearly starting a war, which is nonsense. It is not anybody else's responsibility to ensure that your guild members comply with your guild's regulations. If one of your members helps TGFT inappropriately, that is the member's problem for being ignorant and undisciplined, and your problem for permitting ignorant undisciplined members in your guild. Threatening to go to war with a guild just because they asked one of your members for help that the member wasn't authorized to give is completely idiotic, on par with getting into fights over name calling.

The only thing I found interesting in that thread was the claim that you've "wrecked the shit out of" my guild. It looks like I may need to start making time for VO again, because the noobs are getting uppity.
May 14, 2015 brzi95 link
No i didnt tell we gona go in war i told we are goona atack they stations if we dont hawe a key,and also all other unkeyed to us stations
And yeah we did wreck them IGVT 17 : 2 Famy kills IGVT 14 : 4 Void kills and sieger witnessed that
May 14, 2015 Pizzasgood link
Seventeen kills? How cute.
May 14, 2015 csgno1 link
I had a long discussion last night with a member of TGFT on this topic. Essentially they will only provide keys to INV and IGVT if said guilds take stations then provide keys to TGFT.

The basic problems with this logic are:

1) If you are trying to be a neutral trade guild then there is no path to key access from TGFT

2) Only TGFT has a policy of denying keys to these guilds, so TGFT is creating an incentive for these guilds to work against them instead of with them. It is self-defeating.

My guild (itan) is trying hard to not get between TGFT and SKV so as a consequence we have not been taking stations and therefore have not had owner keys. I find myself now not able to provide user keys to people I'm selling FCP to, which is an annoying inconvenience at best.

My advice to TGFT is to ignore the breying of some of the newer players, take a deep breath, and come up with policies that make sense for TGFT in the long run. I believe the current balance of power is not going to last.
May 14, 2015 RoboticMechanicalJeb link
^
May 14, 2015 Pizzasgood link
So you mean the biggest trade guild isn't going out of its way to help its competitors? Wow, they're so evil!
May 14, 2015 RoboticMechanicalJeb link
BRZI!
In order to get a key, you have to help TGFT re-claim the Conq. stations.

And brzi, stop this thing, you only want to have those keys and not give it to anyone else.
May 14, 2015 brzi95 link
Vladimir you hawe some serios problems
May 14, 2015 bojansplash link
All neutral guilds have free access to conquerable stations held by SKV.
We intend to keep stations open for everyone as long as they keep their neutrality in SKV vs TGFT conflict.

Breaking neutrality status by helping TGFT conquer our stations will invoke serious ramifications.

SKV Command
May 14, 2015 idd link
May 15, 2015 Pizzasgood link
You're late to the party, idd. TGFT has gotten shy and doesn't want people reading its dirty underwear any more. This is why you have to check the forum in the morning, before they have a chance to get dressed.
May 15, 2015 Kierky link
brzi, kindly past your chat logs in the rp forums, don't link to TGFT forums, they love to delete things they don't want seen.
May 15, 2015 brzi95 link
Sure [Thu May 14 07:07:31 2015] [100] <kbireta> famy trident jumped to odia o7
[Thu May 14 07:07:57 2015] [100] <kbireta> any ONE available to help with famy dent?
[Thu May 14 07:08:29 2015] [100] <kbireta> oh, wait, all stations are protected by famy now, ONE and SKV
[Thu May 14 07:10:21 2015] [100] <kbireta> Lanigiro, you igvt lt? you have dent? you fight famy dent? I support?
[Thu May 14 07:10:51 2015] [100] <kbireta> IGVT Lanigiro you going to hide from famy pirate dent?
[Thu May 14 07:10:56 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> no
[Thu May 14 07:11:15 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> I have full load of FCP's
[Thu May 14 07:11:23 2015] [100] <kbireta> you need assistance to kill famy Megadigit dent?
[Thu May 14 07:11:31 2015] [100] <Megedagik> thanks for letting everyone know
[Thu May 14 07:11:33 2015] [100] <kbireta> ow, I cuold use some
[Thu May 14 07:11:57 2015] [100] <kbireta> you need assistance Lanigiro?
[Thu May 14 07:11:58 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> maybe later kbireta
[Thu May 14 07:12:10 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> I need to switch ships etc...
[Thu May 14 07:12:33 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> Megedick.. lol
[Thu May 14 07:13:03 2015] [100] <kbireta> seriously, igvt need assistance? I can bring pcb?
[Thu May 14 07:13:28 2015] [100] <kbireta> someone else needs to bring deshieldign rag
[Thu May 14 07:14:05 2015] [100] kbireta yawns, igvt no guts no glory
[Thu May 14 07:14:28 2015] [100] <Lanigiro Elbbarcs> kbireta, i said later, sry.. need to unload first
[Thu May 14 07:15:06 2015] [100] <kbireta> famy Megedagik left latos o12

Private chat (I noticed, I don't have the key to pelatus..):
[Thu May 14 07:27:44 2015] ->kbireta: "does thft own pelatus c-12?"
[Thu May 14 07:27:54 2015] ->kbireta: "*tgft"
[Thu May 14 07:28:08 2015] *kbireta* yes
[Thu May 14 07:28:43 2015] ->kbireta: "would you help me getting the key?"
[Thu May 14 07:28:59 2015] *kbireta* we own c12 and m14, did you help take them?
[Thu May 14 07:29:22 2015] ->kbireta: "i didn't help cause IGVT is neutral guild"
[Thu May 14 07:29:33 2015] *kbireta* then no key
[Thu May 14 07:29:35 2015] ->kbireta: "we fight rats and griefers only"
[Thu May 14 07:29:45 2015] *kbireta* then you go keyless
[Thu May 14 07:29:50 2015] ->kbireta: "ok"
[Thu May 14 07:30:01 2015] *kbireta* we dont subsidize other trading guilds
[Thu May 14 07:30:20 2015] *kbireta* igvt assists we share
[Thu May 14 07:30:36 2015] ->kbireta: "well,, I unload, and come to hunt famy"
[Thu May 14 07:30:52 2015] *kbireta* or help take i8?
[Thu May 14 07:31:02 2015] ->kbireta: "sry, that's not possible"
[Thu May 14 07:31:12 2015] *kbireta* all three station on same key, you get keyed to three stations?
[Thu May 14 07:31:47 2015] ->kbireta: "we are staying neutral on this.. If we don't get some keychains, then it's just life"
[Thu May 14 07:32:49 2015] *kbireta* ok, my goal is to make sure IGVT never gets keys, no more dents
[Thu May 14 07:33:41 2015] *kbireta* you about to have no keys soon, reconsider?
[Thu May 14 07:34:27 2015] ->kbireta: "well, that's just sad. We would like not to take any part to any 'war' between other guilds. We would like to help TGFT in any other way"
[Thu May 14 07:35:34 2015] *kbireta* you haven't helped with anything
[Thu May 14 07:36:06 2015] ->kbireta: that's not true
[Thu May 14 07:36:19 2015] ->kbireta: I've always been friendly with all TGFT..
[Thu May 14 07:36:27 2015] ->kbireta: ask s6dragon
[Thu May 14 07:36:34 2015] *kbireta* we appreciate you honks
[Thu May 14 07:36:41 2015] ->kbireta: not just that, lol
[Thu May 14 07:37:34 2015] ->kbireta: we have been fighting rats togeter a lot
[Thu May 14 07:38:03 2015] ->kbireta: and I've helped s6dragon to get his SSS back when he died on pelatus c-12.. etc...
[Thu May 14 07:38:14 2015] ->kbireta: all the 'small' things don't count?
[Thu May 14 07:38:16 2015] *kbireta* yes, we consider igvt good rat fighting friends, not so good with stations
[Thu May 14 07:39:10 2015] ->kbireta: yea, that's fine for us.. I'm sorry we don't interfere with the station access changes...
[Thu May 14 07:39:19 2015] *kbireta* I go through much expense fighting for station access
[Thu May 14 07:40:19 2015] *kbireta* grab a rag

Then I didn't reply and started making guild bank log statistics plugin...
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N/- By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 08:18
Now i told kb to not to ask mine members behind mine back for taking ower,he said okay i will not do that..I guess tgft isnt taking things seriosly..i will just say this if we wont hawe access we will be more then happy to blow up all of tgft stations as well as all those ho are there..We are not gona ignore this kinda of crap and we will rasponu to things like this properly
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N/U By kbireta (Councilor) Date 2015-05-14 12:14
He wanted access to c12. I said grab a rag. I did not ask him for help.
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N/U By Sieger (Councilor / Trident Captain) Date 2015-05-14 13:16
An interesting conversation. However I am supporting kbireta a 100%. He has done nothing wrong and simply stated obvious facts. I see no threats or untruth, brzi95.
kbireta stated that in order to have keys, you will have to fight sooner or later. Vendetta is a game of war. You cannot stay neutral because people won't let you. You've been lucky up to now, but it will change as soon as either the Itani or the Serco get tired of keying you for nothing in return. So you'll either start lowering your head and paying them for access or you help them. You'll see.
Additionally, I see no chat message by kb in which he told you to fight over a station? He simply stated that you would have to help to get access. There were no demands. You cannot expect TGFT to not tell you our political stance.

Lastly, I'd like it if you did not threaten us. It is very unclever for a newbie guild to start a war with TGFT...
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N/U By kbireta (Councilor) Date 2015-05-14 13:57
btw, I was making my point with the questions. I knew the answers when I asked them and did not expect your LT to agree at any point. I wanted to make sure your LT understands this is a choice you all are making.
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N/U By Chumboat (Council Member) Date 2015-05-14 14:39
sooo, you wont fight for key access against any other guild.
as i read this you are neutral unless its AGAINST TGFT, in which case threats and attacks are ok?
double standard much?
our guild puts out a lot of time and credits, its only natural that we would expect you to either
A: help in taking stations
or
B: take a station yourself and key us.

you OBVIOUS ALLIANCE with the Rat Guilds is growing more obvious every day brzi
Trader and Rogue Chumboat
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N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 14:42
No we wont fight against nobody ho give us acces
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N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 14:43
And what alliance with a rat guild? We are on famy and vodi koš list bcs we Hunter them and wrecked the shit out of them
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N/U By Chumboat (Council Member) Date 2015-05-14 14:45
Brzi Im afraid that at this time unless your guild has grandfathered in with a previous agreement we will only be keying guilds who either key us or help us take a station.
Trader and Rogue Chumboat
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N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 14:46
And kb you were doing nothing more than provocating an atack on neutral guild to us,which May had lead us into war..And thats nit the first time i hawe goted more then one member complaining to me that you were doing the same
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N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 16:12
So basicly bcs we dont atack skv,one,imam stations and bcs we cant give you keys for it we agent goona be keyed?
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N/U By Chumboat (Council Member) Date 2015-05-14 17:23
Brzi if you would like to actually have real negotiations we would be glad to start a diplomatic board for IGVT and start discussions, but until such time as we come to such an agreement i will restate, unless covered under a previous deal TGFT will only be keying those who either help in the taking of conquerable stations or key us with their keys.
Trader and Rogue Chumboat
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N/U By kbireta (Councilor) Date 2015-05-14 17:54
This should probably be moved to a diplo board
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N/U By RoboticMechanicalJeb Date 2015-05-14 18:06
True dat
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N/U By Chumboat (Council Member) Date 2015-05-14 18:15
thats where im headed with it
Trader and Rogue Chumboat
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N/U By Cron-Wo Bashios Date 2015-05-14 19:30
100% agree
Fear the mighty Centaur!
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- N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-14 23:14
Diplomacy is wery simple if we hawe keys we wont atack if we dont we will...
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Parent N/U By kbireta (Councilor) Date 2015-05-14 23:18
So, we should consider IGVT potentially hostile?
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N/U By brzi95 Date 2015-05-15 10:07
No we are strictly defensive and focused on our goals, and our primati goal is trident manufacturing,so we need keys with geting them on friendly based or by taking over unkeyed station and also then nit giving the key to those ho werent key ing us
May 15, 2015 brzi95 link
There you go Boys
May 15, 2015 MrAbsurd link
yeah ok so the vet traders have a problem with the newb traders. cool

why are you telling us this?
May 15, 2015 bladerus link
Diplomatic discussions are not supposed to be brought to public, unless someone has a definite goal with it. It seems to me, that brzi95 definitely wants to bring internal discussions to public.

brzi95 your credit as an official diplomat will significantly decrease, if you continue in this manner.

The thread that you intended to make public was intentionally moved to a restricted access zone. If you have problems with TGFT, please let's discuss them in our Diplo board, where both guilds' representatives have the opportunity to present their arguments and finally we may come to an agreement.

This is not a BB TV show where you go to the secret room and tell all your secrets/opinion to the public, so finally everyone else is laughing at you.
May 15, 2015 bojansplash link
TGFT stands for FREE TRADE and LIVING WELL IN THE UNIVERSE, right?

They forgot to add the small print: "only if you are in TGFT or you work for us. Otherwise you die."

P.S. Brzi had every right to bring this to public - it shows the REAL face of TGFT and it ain't pretty.
May 15, 2015 idd link
Welcome to VO brzi, RED has been dealing with these idiots for a long time.

Btw, I'm going to give you a hint: TGFT are wussies and can't fight for shit.