Forums » Suggestions
The idea is simple. A person writes a plugin and they want to use it on VO. They can do so in offline mode the same way plugins currently work. This is intended for the testing of the plugin.
Once they are happy with the plugin, they submit it to the devs who review the code of the plugin to make sure nothing detrimental to the spirit of the game is being done. After the review the plugin is encrypted with a private key only the devs have and posted in a new section of the site for optional plugins and made available to anyone who wants to try it.
Installing is done the same way as now, only there are no individual files, just one. Upon load, the game will verify the integrity of the plugin in a way similar to how it verifies it's own files and decrypt the plugin in memory. Plugins can only be submitted by users and any user found to submit a malicious plugin should be banned and their characters deleted.
The source for the plugin is not shared on the site. That is left to the original author's discretion.
This will effectively end cheating and out-of-gameplay unfair advantages related to bot accounts. Forcing any plugin that effects the MMO to be equally available and tamper-free is also necessary to fix this problem. That way everyone is given the abliity to actually be playing the same game that they're investing money and time in and this will only become more important as more players come on.
Once they are happy with the plugin, they submit it to the devs who review the code of the plugin to make sure nothing detrimental to the spirit of the game is being done. After the review the plugin is encrypted with a private key only the devs have and posted in a new section of the site for optional plugins and made available to anyone who wants to try it.
Installing is done the same way as now, only there are no individual files, just one. Upon load, the game will verify the integrity of the plugin in a way similar to how it verifies it's own files and decrypt the plugin in memory. Plugins can only be submitted by users and any user found to submit a malicious plugin should be banned and their characters deleted.
The source for the plugin is not shared on the site. That is left to the original author's discretion.
This will effectively end cheating and out-of-gameplay unfair advantages related to bot accounts. Forcing any plugin that effects the MMO to be equally available and tamper-free is also necessary to fix this problem. That way everyone is given the abliity to actually be playing the same game that they're investing money and time in and this will only become more important as more players come on.
+1 to a donatation link to pay for a dev to review/validate plugins
Somehow I don't think this is a good use of the devs time.
That game was made to be customised, if code exists in the game that could potentially cheat the game, we need to find it, report it and then plugins are free to be used without some sort of "administrative oversight". It would kill the game for a lot of players.
That game was made to be customised, if code exists in the game that could potentially cheat the game, we need to find it, report it and then plugins are free to be used without some sort of "administrative oversight". It would kill the game for a lot of players.
-1 to OP.
+1 to Greenwall, but make it $100 (or more) per plugin for dev review.
+1 to Greenwall, but make it $100 (or more) per plugin for dev review.
There are so many guild specific non-public plugin use cases that this is not a good suggestion.
World of War craft hasn't ever done this. Why should a small indie development team with far more limited resources?
-1. This is beyond stupid.
While it's not a great suggestion, the inspiration for it is real, and supports things I said here:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/1/28771
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/1/28771
-1
That's a different topic greenwall.
That topic: needed interface data is not available by default.
This topic: guilds reporting player activity creates an unfair advantage.
That being said, I think a community review process on voupr would be advantageous with risk levels determined by the number of "sign-offs" a plugin has received. New, potentially unstable plugin or versions would be categorized as such, letting players choose the level of potential instability they are comfortable with.
If the devs aren't going to implement a plugin repository, they should at least create the plugins directory by default and provide a mechanism to install a plugin through the game interface.
That topic: needed interface data is not available by default.
This topic: guilds reporting player activity creates an unfair advantage.
That being said, I think a community review process on voupr would be advantageous with risk levels determined by the number of "sign-offs" a plugin has received. New, potentially unstable plugin or versions would be categorized as such, letting players choose the level of potential instability they are comfortable with.
If the devs aren't going to implement a plugin repository, they should at least create the plugins directory by default and provide a mechanism to install a plugin through the game interface.
Not really, Savet. Both my thread and this OP deal with the "unfair" advantages offered by plugins.
Cellsafemode seems to be bothered that other people who play the same game as him have clear and distinct advantages offered by plugins that he either doesn't have access to or doesn't have the ability to create on his own.
I totally agree with that ^-- but I don't agree with his suggestion, primiarily because I know there is no way in hell the devs would ever agree to it.
This is a pretty important issue, really.
Cellsafemode seems to be bothered that other people who play the same game as him have clear and distinct advantages offered by plugins that he either doesn't have access to or doesn't have the ability to create on his own.
I totally agree with that ^-- but I don't agree with his suggestion, primiarily because I know there is no way in hell the devs would ever agree to it.
This is a pretty important issue, really.
But my point is that the post you linked deals with a real problem that can be addressed, which is standardization of plugin availability and installation....and incorporating needed features into the default experience. This thread deals with not having privileged data that is not central or required for a good out-of-the-box experience.
-1
I am not aware of a problem with people using plugins to cheat. There have occasionally been reporting bots, which do confer an advantage. If the devs deem that a problem, it could be considerably limited by logging out users who don't use the keyboard/mouse/touchscreen/joystick/etc... for a long time.
Automated reporting by live users doesn't seem like an unfair advantage. Most long-time players have, at a minimum binds for reporting enemy sightings to their group or guild, if not a public channel like VPR does with 4357 for pirate sightings.
I am not aware of a problem with people using plugins to cheat. There have occasionally been reporting bots, which do confer an advantage. If the devs deem that a problem, it could be considerably limited by logging out users who don't use the keyboard/mouse/touchscreen/joystick/etc... for a long time.
Automated reporting by live users doesn't seem like an unfair advantage. Most long-time players have, at a minimum binds for reporting enemy sightings to their group or guild, if not a public channel like VPR does with 4357 for pirate sightings.
It's an interesting idea. Ultimately I think the plan is to build in a lot more customization possibilities. For now, though, there continue to be changes that break existing plugins. That would multiply the work the devs need to do.
I gave a +1 to dev reviewed plugins at a cost per the Greenwall idea. I'm not saying that ALL plugins should even require this. Just ppl that would like dev a review of their plugin, otherwise it would stay the same.
It's not going to happen I doubt as per the OP, but ya.
Devs have better things to do anyways.
It's not going to happen I doubt as per the OP, but ya.
Devs have better things to do anyways.
"Cellsafemode seems to be bothered that other people who play the same game as him have clear and distinct advantages offered by plugins that he either doesn't have access to or doesn't have the ability to create on his own."
What unfair advantages?
Note that all of these are publicly available to anybody who has the basic computer knowledge required to create a folder and unzip a zipfile:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/28783#347704
http://www.voupr.com/list.php
If there are significant advantages that are not publicly available, tell us about them. Put up or shut up.
What unfair advantages?
Note that all of these are publicly available to anybody who has the basic computer knowledge required to create a folder and unzip a zipfile:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/28783#347704
http://www.voupr.com/list.php
If there are significant advantages that are not publicly available, tell us about them. Put up or shut up.
lol rin
They should hire a crack team of seasoned bureaucrats to handle this effectively. Plugin submissions need to be turned in handwritten on 3 part forms along with a 3.5" floppy disk containing Microsoft Visio format flow charts detailing the plugin's intended operation and failure modes. Plugins must utilize flat-file comms for data exchange using signed overpunch number formats.
cellsafemode, what advantages do you think somebody is getting by running a 'bot'? Chat relays? Monitoring a station log? Cataloging trade prices? If you think somebody is cheating just put in a support ticket.
cellsafemode, what advantages do you think somebody is getting by running a 'bot'? Chat relays? Monitoring a station log? Cataloging trade prices? If you think somebody is cheating just put in a support ticket.
Since Cellsafemode has given up on his own thread, I'll carry it's banner.
Synopsis of VO from the main page:
Vendetta Online is a 3D space combat MMORPG for Windows, Mac, Linux and Android. This MMO permits thousands of players to interact as the pilots of spaceships in a vast universe. Users may build their characters in any direction they desire, becoming rich captains of industry, military heroes, or outlaws. A fast-paced, realtime "twitch" style combat model gives intense action, coupled with the backdrop of RPG gameplay in a massive online galaxy. Three major player factions form a delicate balance of power, with several NPC sub-factions creating situations of economic struggle, political intrigue and conflict. The completely persistent universe and detailed storyline add to the depth of immersion, resulting in a unique online experience.
You'll notice there is NO mention there whatsoever of plugins or modifications to the game. AND YET, one quickly discovers as they start playing that plugins are NECESSARY. Draugath's DroidButtons are virtually required for newbs to have a non-crappy android experience. Targetless is required for basic situational awareness. The list goes on. And then eventually, the people who stick it out long enough to understand what other plugins are available, will realize there's a whole lot of shit that plugins do for people in the game that gives a HUGE advantage to those who don't have it SUCH AS: Spotting notifications, trade and mining databases, player activity statistics, alt trackers, pvp assisters, HUD and view modifiers, station key and ctc bots...etc etc.
So, "cheating" isn't really the correct word here, because it implies deceit and breaking rules (i.e. hacking); and since VO is a sandbox game (something else not explicitly mentioned in the synopsis), there are no rules to break. "Unexpected advantage" is probably a better term. Plugins aren't against the rules, but Guild Software doesn't tell you you need them to excel, and even if they did, you are at the mercy of other people helping you find those plugins, unless you are in the large minority of people who can actually write them.
Imagine going to a track and field event only to find when you get there that everyone has bionic exoskeletons... everyone but you. And they tell you "yeah this is one of the cool things about this event -- you can use your own bionic exoskeleton to help you run faster, jump higher, calculate efficiency, etc -- but only if you can make it yourself or if you have a friend to make it for you". And you say "i don't know how to do that", and they say "well we have a collection of free basic exoskeletons on the third floor of an office building downtown, but you need to know how to assemble them and activate them...and they aren't officially suported by anyone, so if they break or malfunction it's up to you to fix them"... and this whole time you are thinking "BUT I JUST WANTED TO FUCKING RUN IN A FUCKING RACE".
The playing field must be levelled or VO is always going to be a boutique game.
Synopsis of VO from the main page:
Vendetta Online is a 3D space combat MMORPG for Windows, Mac, Linux and Android. This MMO permits thousands of players to interact as the pilots of spaceships in a vast universe. Users may build their characters in any direction they desire, becoming rich captains of industry, military heroes, or outlaws. A fast-paced, realtime "twitch" style combat model gives intense action, coupled with the backdrop of RPG gameplay in a massive online galaxy. Three major player factions form a delicate balance of power, with several NPC sub-factions creating situations of economic struggle, political intrigue and conflict. The completely persistent universe and detailed storyline add to the depth of immersion, resulting in a unique online experience.
You'll notice there is NO mention there whatsoever of plugins or modifications to the game. AND YET, one quickly discovers as they start playing that plugins are NECESSARY. Draugath's DroidButtons are virtually required for newbs to have a non-crappy android experience. Targetless is required for basic situational awareness. The list goes on. And then eventually, the people who stick it out long enough to understand what other plugins are available, will realize there's a whole lot of shit that plugins do for people in the game that gives a HUGE advantage to those who don't have it SUCH AS: Spotting notifications, trade and mining databases, player activity statistics, alt trackers, pvp assisters, HUD and view modifiers, station key and ctc bots...etc etc.
So, "cheating" isn't really the correct word here, because it implies deceit and breaking rules (i.e. hacking); and since VO is a sandbox game (something else not explicitly mentioned in the synopsis), there are no rules to break. "Unexpected advantage" is probably a better term. Plugins aren't against the rules, but Guild Software doesn't tell you you need them to excel, and even if they did, you are at the mercy of other people helping you find those plugins, unless you are in the large minority of people who can actually write them.
Imagine going to a track and field event only to find when you get there that everyone has bionic exoskeletons... everyone but you. And they tell you "yeah this is one of the cool things about this event -- you can use your own bionic exoskeleton to help you run faster, jump higher, calculate efficiency, etc -- but only if you can make it yourself or if you have a friend to make it for you". And you say "i don't know how to do that", and they say "well we have a collection of free basic exoskeletons on the third floor of an office building downtown, but you need to know how to assemble them and activate them...and they aren't officially suported by anyone, so if they break or malfunction it's up to you to fix them"... and this whole time you are thinking "BUT I JUST WANTED TO FUCKING RUN IN A FUCKING RACE".
The playing field must be levelled or VO is always going to be a boutique game.
Your analogy is broken. First of all, the the publicly available plugins aren't some basic versions; they're the exact same plugins everybody uses besides the occasional hipster. Secondly, there is no complicated process for installing them like you keep saying. You create one folder, then expand a zip file. The end. Third... major hyperbole on the advantage they give (other than perhaps DroidButtons; I have no mobile devices so I can't really comment on that, but I hear it's way better than stock).
A better analogy is that you go to a track and field event and realize everybody else is wearing running shoes, sweat wicking clothes, and some stylish fuckin' shades. You're maybe a little put out because you thought it was just going to be a more casual event and you don't want to buy all kinds of gear. But as you get to talking, somebody mentions that there's a club down the road run by some track-wear enthusiasts who make this stuff in their spare time and give it away for free, so you can just go down there and grab some if you want it. That's where almost all of them got theirs, other than a few folks wearing some sketchy stuff they pieced together themselves from scraps taken out of dumpsters which everybody else kind of rolls their eyes at.
A better analogy is that you go to a track and field event and realize everybody else is wearing running shoes, sweat wicking clothes, and some stylish fuckin' shades. You're maybe a little put out because you thought it was just going to be a more casual event and you don't want to buy all kinds of gear. But as you get to talking, somebody mentions that there's a club down the road run by some track-wear enthusiasts who make this stuff in their spare time and give it away for free, so you can just go down there and grab some if you want it. That's where almost all of them got theirs, other than a few folks wearing some sketchy stuff they pieced together themselves from scraps taken out of dumpsters which everybody else kind of rolls their eyes at.