(See results in the previous message)

Ok, here's an idea that was mentioned during the bar chat after the race. I'd like to see what people on both sides of the race think of adding BOTH of the following rules (it's a package deal):

1) The Deneb Run won't pay pirates for kills that take place in Odia M-14.

AND

2) Racers are no longer allowed to dock mid-race.

Again, "a monkey in a rocket spammer camping the dock can take out a racer". Which is how I got 800k, or would've if I hadn't given it to the person I killed. I'm trying to prove a point, which thankfully is reflected in Screwball's suggestion. Station camping is too easy.

I like the idea that you shouldnt kill them while station camping, but just as they warp out the WH or something, you should get paid (either by the event host or spuck)

Making M-14 a no-kill zone both at the start and finish should make it a bit fair. However, playing devil's advocate here:

How to make sure a racer didn't dock to repair? People usually find out when the racer calls out his being damaged; all he has to do is keep quiet to keep everybody in the dark. The only ones who could know for sure would be his competitors IF they are in the same sector as him to both see his damage and his subsequential recovery; furthermore, the racers are usually spread out by the time the race enters Itaniland, so it's unlikely his fellow racers will even know he got damaged once the race reaches that point. Of course, you could have the attackers call out when they hit someone, but that just lends itself to abuse: if a pirate claims to have damaged player X without actually doing so, and then player X shows up in full health, he could be accused of repairing and be disqualified without him actually doing anything wrong! And then there's the rare (but it has happened twice in the last four runs) instance when a racer is not part of the group. How do check for damage to his ship then?

In other words, this particular rule could be kind of hard to enforce. My opinion? scrap it. Repairing brings its own drawbacks in time delay, specially when you hit a storm on your way to the station (happened to Joyce twice in the three times she had to repair last race, once in Ukari and once in Pelatus) which can cost you the prize money; it also fails to eliminate the pirate threat, you still have to deal with them until you dock or die.

If you can find a 100% sure-fire way to determine if a racer repaired or not, then I'm all for this rule.

I completely agree that in an ideal world all rules should be enforcable and verifyable. However, I also think that sometimes we just have to trust people in order to get to a higher place (a more enjoyable event).

Of course, I could be missing something. Does anyone have any brilliant ideas on detecting if someone has docked?

One idea might be to require all players to run a repeating alias that reports their postion in group chat every 30 seconds. However, that's complex, annoying to the players, and still might not reveal when a player docks at a wormhole station.

Perhaps (long term) the Devs could add something to the group HUD or /group view or something like that that reports player position and docking status? Come to think of it, that would also be a great feature for /guild.

hit em once with a weak weapon

edit: dang they could still dock and get shot with the same weapon -.-

Hm. I agree with jexkerome on the docking. In F1 races, you are allowed to make as many pit-stops as you want, but you lose precious time. I say keep it that way, because it really, really sucks when you get away from a pirate, lead with 5 minutes and then get blasted just because you couldn't dock. I would consider that a source of frustration that could induce players not to participate. However, let's try it out and see how it works out.

As for the Odia being a no-kill zone, that is as unenforcable as the 'no docking' rule.

On the situation reports: During the race, I actually considered not sending status reports at all, to deny the pirates every little bit of information I could. I do see that that would defeat the purpose of the MC relaying the race to general chat, and I'm also unsure as to how big the advantage is if you fly 'under cover'.

I was actually flying Vult mkIII not hornet.

And i'm against not allowing docking. I don't know about others but i'd rather have pirates attacking me in M14 then not being allowed to dock - without docking i'd be dead 3 times along the way anyhow.

Actually i dont see why if pirates don't get rewarded for kills in one sector racers have to be denied anything for that.

Mick

Let's list the problems that sparked this debate:

1) Pirates are getting money from a non-race sponsor host.
2) Pirates are camping M-14 for easy kills and money from said Race Sponsoring host.
3) Docking is seen as "cheap" by some pirates

Here are my suggestions:

1) That's great! Now that the MC doesn't need to pay the pirates to show how much we love how they spice up the race, why should he? Spuck's doing a magnificent job with hosting his own "get the Racers" event
2) There is no real way to enforce a rule o protect the racers. Even if the MC continues to pay the pirates and tells them kills in M-14 don't count, Spuck will still pay for kills there. Solution: Get some help from others. Viper, and other guilds could clear out station campers.
3) (b^.^)b That's nice. This has the same problem as #2, non-enforcable. Plus, if the pirates aren't being paid by the MC anymore, then it really isn't his concern so much Spuck's.

What it comes down to is honesty and trust. I personally won't dock and repair/reload if there are no pirates camping M-14. I am willing to trade one for the other.

Toshiro, reporting back also ensures the racers don't cheat by, say, homing previously in Deneb and then /exploding in Sol II once the race starts, getting a huge boost ahead by doing so. That's why also failing to consistently report your location will get you disqualified.

As for the M-14 "No killing", while you can't enforce that they don't kill anyone, you CAN determine if they killed someone in M-14 and disqualify the killer from getting prize money. Of course, with spuck giving money now of his own pocket, that just means less money for the pirate, which is also why it would be best for TGFT and EnB to no longer pay the pirates.

That makes sense, I completely forgot about cheating...

Of course you can just deny the pirates their prize money... however, I see that as being only a small deterrent, epsecially since, as you said, mr_spuck pays them anyway if they kill racers.

I agree with Blacklight. Congratulations! (1st page)

I always ask that the home mining station be a no-fire zone when I run mining events. I have to be outside to collect the ores and I don't need the hassle of SF swarming or getting caught in the crossfire.