Forums » Community Projects
Response to "VetsFTW" post.
(EDIT: This will eventually move to Community Projects, because I don't like angsty stuff in General. I'll leave it here for a little while).
Demnicat chose to grace us with a lengthy rant supposedly sourced from a "few vets".
I have removed this post, because it made a bunch of claims that are factually wrong, some of which basically claim that we're lying about everything we're doing; and after years of corrosive conspiracy-theory bullshit, I'm not putting up with that crap anymore.
Anyone who wants to spread the idea that, for instance, "Incarnate is the only person on the VO team".. they can get their account perma-banned. I don't really need to hear from those people any more. I don't want them around.
I will "briefly" respond to a few of the other points
Most of the (very long, ranting) post was just.. nonsense. Examples (some unintentionally amusing) of someone not understanding what they were reading from our changelogs, and interpreting it in the most angsty manner possible.
I've tried to crop out a lot of the angst and focus on a few major topics (and yet, even cut down, it's still so long.. ugh):
Added a sector load time client-side analytic to help detect long sector loads.
\ If anybody ever had an issue with the speed of sector loading, whatever that could possibly mean, it wouldn’t even help to have an analytic formula detector for it.
The analytic is for us, so we can see when sectors are loading slowly. Why would we add measurement if it wasn't a problem?
Fixed Quest crash if the game is quit very early in the loading process.
\ How could anybody expect to complete quests if they just quit the game? What?
"Quest" is a reference to the "Oculus Quest", a VR device we support. We don't refer to missions as "quests". Ever.
Reduced the amount of mission information sent to players when they log in, speeding up login time.
\ When I log in, I’ve never gotten mission information.
Not visible information. Instead your client was getting a ton of invisible information, which had no value to those players, and was saturating their bandwidth. You know, because that's how games freaking work? Developers have to move data around, and synchronize game state? It was a dumb design-flaw that had become worse than expected (and it was absolutely noticed by some players).
Updated the client mission cache to improve login behaviour on some latent connections.
\ If you have a “latent connection”, please speak up, we don’t know whether you exist.
Yes, actually, it is most players. And the angsty vets represented here probably don't play anymore, so.. not them.
Expanded and improved game translations, particularly Portuguese.
\ YOU JUST SAID THIS, YOU DID IT AGAIN? HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU GET TO DO THIS? DO YOU WANT A GOLD STAR EACH TIME?
There are like 350,000 words in the game. We just report the things that are changing in the patch. Yes, localizations take time, and are iterative. There will be MANY, MANY MORE posts like this. We haven't even gotten people to start "proofing" the Asian languages yet. Some people are WAITING for these changes, we know this, because they ask us all the time "When will XX localization be improved???", so we put it in the changelog so they understand we're trying to improve things.
Updated Windows code signing signatures.
\ What?
Windows has an ever-evolving binary signature system, which is the only thing that keeps our game from getting automatically deleted by Windows 10+ as "malware". Just because you don't understand something, doesn't mean it's irrelevant.
Fixed issue with ship collision responses against the turrets of other ships.
\ Thank god you did this, I was so incredibly worried and affected by it. I thought about it day and night. You are such a thoughtful, inspiring dev.
This was actually being used to troll capship players pretty commonly, since someone in a small turreted ship, like an Atlas, could make a Trident spin like a top due to the improper collision response, and prevent them from flying. This was a big deal. But, only to actual players, which does not include those writing this oh-so-informed rant.
Updated Russian translations, mainly tutorials, faction descriptions, and voice-overs.
\ SURELY THIS WILL BRING SO MANY RUSSIAN PLAYERS AND IMPROVE THE GAME!
Russia has been our #3 locale for something like a decade now. That's why it was one of the first languages we targeted. Yes, there are lots of Russians on, every single day. Again, good thing you're so well informed.
Updated Android version using the latest NDK and Clang compiler.
\ Please waste time doing this again as soon as the next NDK and Clang compiler gets released.
Actually, we hadn't updated the compiler in FOURTEEN YEARS. We were way out of date (still using GCC, even), and we needed to update all our compilers to support modern C++ standards, because library requirements are evolving. Yes, it's a big undertaking. NO, it is not one we do all the time, as evidenced by how long it had been.
Updated app to satisfy new Play Store requirements.
\ I guess this is acceptable, but no dev in the world mentions this, only you incarnate. Don’t even mention it, we don’t care! ITS PART OF YOUR JOB. DID YOU CLOCK IN ON TIME? THANKS FOR LETTING US KNOW
The patch log is a log of what is in the patch, as it has been for twenty four years. We try to include everything, to be transparent. And sometimes, these stupid Play Store requirements can be quite time consuming. We don't care what "other devs" are mentioning, and we don't care how you feel about it. Get over yourself. You don't "represent" anyone's community, even "the VO vets". There are plenty of vets who are more understanding than you, and some that are interested to know what we're doing (and some that are directly impacted by these changes you don't care about).
AFTER 10 MONTHS OF RADIO SILENCE, INCARNATE (the only person who exists on the VO team) graces us with a report on thorough, substantial, meaningful developments to the game.
A few statistics to keep in mind:
-it has been 10 years since a new player owned capital ship has been added to the game
-it has been longer than that since any ship of any class has been added to the game
So, first of all, as I mentioned above: No, I am (pretty obviously) not "the only person on the VO team".
Secondly, I have ZERO interest in adding more capital ships at this time, as I've explained elsewhere.
Thirdly, I have near-ZERO interest in adding more fighter ships either, we're in the middle of a tech revamp, so that's really not ideal.
(In both cases, we want to add them in due course; but not without a bunch of updates to other systems first).
What I am trying to do is actually expand our gameplay mechanics, build systems that we can maintain to drive new types of gameplay (like Persistent Events), and fix a lot of long-standing problems so we can expand things meaningfully without the game technology (or the developers) imploding.
You know how people are aware of that? Because I WROTE IT DOWN in the Game Development Direction thread. Please read it, and count how many times it references "new ships" (zero).
I would have a lot more empathy for your level of disappointment, except that you guys are dicks, immersed in a bath of your own self-righteous bullshit. And honestly, I'd rather not interact with such people. I'd prefer you went and played something else and never came back.
At the end of the day: You Want What You Want, and you don't really care whether it's good or bad for us, you can rationalize it to yourself somehow. You just "want" it. I have to make different choices. I have to keep us in business for the long haul, make sure people can pay rent and mortgages, and mostly all your complaining illustrates that you don't freaking understand anything (and that you aren't willing to ask questions, like a reasonable person).
Lastly: Why do you think I've been radio silent? Do you think it's because I want attention? No, I've written about that at length too. We're in the middle of trying to rebuild an airplane while it's in flight, and it's a huge pain in the ass. The last thing I want is more "reviews" to pop up right now.
We are doing the grinding, unpleasant work that is needed. Yes, it has taken a lot longer than I expected. We have also been delayed by "Vets" making up imaginary bullshit that absorbed huge amounts of development time. So, let's not forget that crap either, okay?
If you find us (or me) utterly irredeemable as a developer, and unworthy of your trust, and you consider our game to be stupid and terrible, then go play Elite or EVE or something. Godspeed! I won't hold it against you. Just stop yelling dumb crap at me because you're frustrated and unreasonable. That's a waste of everyone's energy. (I'm generally willing to answer reasonable questions, but I don't react well to "angsty self-righteous BS").
Demnicat chose to grace us with a lengthy rant supposedly sourced from a "few vets".
I have removed this post, because it made a bunch of claims that are factually wrong, some of which basically claim that we're lying about everything we're doing; and after years of corrosive conspiracy-theory bullshit, I'm not putting up with that crap anymore.
Anyone who wants to spread the idea that, for instance, "Incarnate is the only person on the VO team".. they can get their account perma-banned. I don't really need to hear from those people any more. I don't want them around.
I will "briefly" respond to a few of the other points
Most of the (very long, ranting) post was just.. nonsense. Examples (some unintentionally amusing) of someone not understanding what they were reading from our changelogs, and interpreting it in the most angsty manner possible.
I've tried to crop out a lot of the angst and focus on a few major topics (and yet, even cut down, it's still so long.. ugh):
Added a sector load time client-side analytic to help detect long sector loads.
\ If anybody ever had an issue with the speed of sector loading, whatever that could possibly mean, it wouldn’t even help to have an analytic formula detector for it.
The analytic is for us, so we can see when sectors are loading slowly. Why would we add measurement if it wasn't a problem?
Fixed Quest crash if the game is quit very early in the loading process.
\ How could anybody expect to complete quests if they just quit the game? What?
"Quest" is a reference to the "Oculus Quest", a VR device we support. We don't refer to missions as "quests". Ever.
Reduced the amount of mission information sent to players when they log in, speeding up login time.
\ When I log in, I’ve never gotten mission information.
Not visible information. Instead your client was getting a ton of invisible information, which had no value to those players, and was saturating their bandwidth. You know, because that's how games freaking work? Developers have to move data around, and synchronize game state? It was a dumb design-flaw that had become worse than expected (and it was absolutely noticed by some players).
Updated the client mission cache to improve login behaviour on some latent connections.
\ If you have a “latent connection”, please speak up, we don’t know whether you exist.
Yes, actually, it is most players. And the angsty vets represented here probably don't play anymore, so.. not them.
Expanded and improved game translations, particularly Portuguese.
\ YOU JUST SAID THIS, YOU DID IT AGAIN? HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU GET TO DO THIS? DO YOU WANT A GOLD STAR EACH TIME?
There are like 350,000 words in the game. We just report the things that are changing in the patch. Yes, localizations take time, and are iterative. There will be MANY, MANY MORE posts like this. We haven't even gotten people to start "proofing" the Asian languages yet. Some people are WAITING for these changes, we know this, because they ask us all the time "When will XX localization be improved???", so we put it in the changelog so they understand we're trying to improve things.
Updated Windows code signing signatures.
\ What?
Windows has an ever-evolving binary signature system, which is the only thing that keeps our game from getting automatically deleted by Windows 10+ as "malware". Just because you don't understand something, doesn't mean it's irrelevant.
Fixed issue with ship collision responses against the turrets of other ships.
\ Thank god you did this, I was so incredibly worried and affected by it. I thought about it day and night. You are such a thoughtful, inspiring dev.
This was actually being used to troll capship players pretty commonly, since someone in a small turreted ship, like an Atlas, could make a Trident spin like a top due to the improper collision response, and prevent them from flying. This was a big deal. But, only to actual players, which does not include those writing this oh-so-informed rant.
Updated Russian translations, mainly tutorials, faction descriptions, and voice-overs.
\ SURELY THIS WILL BRING SO MANY RUSSIAN PLAYERS AND IMPROVE THE GAME!
Russia has been our #3 locale for something like a decade now. That's why it was one of the first languages we targeted. Yes, there are lots of Russians on, every single day. Again, good thing you're so well informed.
Updated Android version using the latest NDK and Clang compiler.
\ Please waste time doing this again as soon as the next NDK and Clang compiler gets released.
Actually, we hadn't updated the compiler in FOURTEEN YEARS. We were way out of date (still using GCC, even), and we needed to update all our compilers to support modern C++ standards, because library requirements are evolving. Yes, it's a big undertaking. NO, it is not one we do all the time, as evidenced by how long it had been.
Updated app to satisfy new Play Store requirements.
\ I guess this is acceptable, but no dev in the world mentions this, only you incarnate. Don’t even mention it, we don’t care! ITS PART OF YOUR JOB. DID YOU CLOCK IN ON TIME? THANKS FOR LETTING US KNOW
The patch log is a log of what is in the patch, as it has been for twenty four years. We try to include everything, to be transparent. And sometimes, these stupid Play Store requirements can be quite time consuming. We don't care what "other devs" are mentioning, and we don't care how you feel about it. Get over yourself. You don't "represent" anyone's community, even "the VO vets". There are plenty of vets who are more understanding than you, and some that are interested to know what we're doing (and some that are directly impacted by these changes you don't care about).
AFTER 10 MONTHS OF RADIO SILENCE, INCARNATE (the only person who exists on the VO team) graces us with a report on thorough, substantial, meaningful developments to the game.
A few statistics to keep in mind:
-it has been 10 years since a new player owned capital ship has been added to the game
-it has been longer than that since any ship of any class has been added to the game
So, first of all, as I mentioned above: No, I am (pretty obviously) not "the only person on the VO team".
Secondly, I have ZERO interest in adding more capital ships at this time, as I've explained elsewhere.
Thirdly, I have near-ZERO interest in adding more fighter ships either, we're in the middle of a tech revamp, so that's really not ideal.
(In both cases, we want to add them in due course; but not without a bunch of updates to other systems first).
What I am trying to do is actually expand our gameplay mechanics, build systems that we can maintain to drive new types of gameplay (like Persistent Events), and fix a lot of long-standing problems so we can expand things meaningfully without the game technology (or the developers) imploding.
You know how people are aware of that? Because I WROTE IT DOWN in the Game Development Direction thread. Please read it, and count how many times it references "new ships" (zero).
I would have a lot more empathy for your level of disappointment, except that you guys are dicks, immersed in a bath of your own self-righteous bullshit. And honestly, I'd rather not interact with such people. I'd prefer you went and played something else and never came back.
At the end of the day: You Want What You Want, and you don't really care whether it's good or bad for us, you can rationalize it to yourself somehow. You just "want" it. I have to make different choices. I have to keep us in business for the long haul, make sure people can pay rent and mortgages, and mostly all your complaining illustrates that you don't freaking understand anything (and that you aren't willing to ask questions, like a reasonable person).
Lastly: Why do you think I've been radio silent? Do you think it's because I want attention? No, I've written about that at length too. We're in the middle of trying to rebuild an airplane while it's in flight, and it's a huge pain in the ass. The last thing I want is more "reviews" to pop up right now.
We are doing the grinding, unpleasant work that is needed. Yes, it has taken a lot longer than I expected. We have also been delayed by "Vets" making up imaginary bullshit that absorbed huge amounts of development time. So, let's not forget that crap either, okay?
If you find us (or me) utterly irredeemable as a developer, and unworthy of your trust, and you consider our game to be stupid and terrible, then go play Elite or EVE or something. Godspeed! I won't hold it against you. Just stop yelling dumb crap at me because you're frustrated and unreasonable. That's a waste of everyone's energy. (I'm generally willing to answer reasonable questions, but I don't react well to "angsty self-righteous BS").
And you thought I was a pain in the ass LOL
I mean, you could also be a pain in the ass, heheh.
How about getting those 180 railgun turrets back?
See? ;)
I'm bitin' so hard my tongue's bleedin'.
But we always know what is best for the game because we know everything!