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This is a reward for winning, not a punishment for dying.
More importantly, it's a vital incentive for playing like it's an RPG, not a FPS.
VO needs to stop trying to be UT in space - it's not good at it.
More importantly, it's a vital incentive for playing like it's an RPG, not a FPS.
VO needs to stop trying to be UT in space - it's not good at it.
I don't understand the arguments that it would discourage combat. You people must be even more impatient than I am. You die, you wait 20-30 seconds, and you return. That's not enough penalty to turn people into cowards.
As for monetary penalties: No. There already is - re-buying your ship. Besides which, it would not change the actual combat at all, only the amount of it that people do. I have about 60 million credits. The cost of respawning is not going to deter me from combat. All a monetary penalty would do is cause me to spend a greater portion of my time doing more profitable activities than raw combat.
Besides which, that is completely different from the point. Like Peytros said, it isn't about penalizing the loser, it's about changing things so that the winner can accomplish something. Give people a way to hold a position. Saying "Just charge them to respawn" does nothing toward that goal.
As for monetary penalties: No. There already is - re-buying your ship. Besides which, it would not change the actual combat at all, only the amount of it that people do. I have about 60 million credits. The cost of respawning is not going to deter me from combat. All a monetary penalty would do is cause me to spend a greater portion of my time doing more profitable activities than raw combat.
Besides which, that is completely different from the point. Like Peytros said, it isn't about penalizing the loser, it's about changing things so that the winner can accomplish something. Give people a way to hold a position. Saying "Just charge them to respawn" does nothing toward that goal.
If it isn't supposed to be about penalizing the loser then don't suggest penalizing the loser. Come up with a suggestion that does what you want.
I'm not personally against a re-spawn delay, but can see why some might be. If this WERE implemented, I would prefer that it's a launch delay. So you spawn instantly, but can't launch till timer expires, so you can at least do stuff in the station bar/commerce/etc. Maybe add option to pay-off timer, spend credits to launch instantly? Could write this in as, "the docking personal need to do a flight-check on your new ship/neural-interface" or somesuch.
Yeah, a monetary penalty wouldn't change anything and is a terrible idea.
drazed: of course, I was under the impression that this was assumed. (aside from the monetary penalty shortcut)
Lecter: actually, most FPS games today do have respawn timers... mainly because they are objective-based games and not death match games such as quake or UT. In fact, not a single objective based game that I know of has instant respawn and anyone who knows anything about game balance understands that instant respawn in objective-based games is a terrible idea, hell even WoW has a respawn timer and it's not even an FPS. Given that VO is an RPG, I would classify it more as an objective-based FPS rather than a death match FPS hence the need for a respawn timer. (just elaborating on your point, is all)
abortretryfail: You know, I played Battlefield a few times and I thought it was a decent game.
In summary of my position, this is not some radical new idea. It is a basic concept present in all games in which one [group of] player[s] wants something that another [group of] player[s] also wants where that something would be an object or territory aside from frags.
drazed: of course, I was under the impression that this was assumed. (aside from the monetary penalty shortcut)
Lecter: actually, most FPS games today do have respawn timers... mainly because they are objective-based games and not death match games such as quake or UT. In fact, not a single objective based game that I know of has instant respawn and anyone who knows anything about game balance understands that instant respawn in objective-based games is a terrible idea, hell even WoW has a respawn timer and it's not even an FPS. Given that VO is an RPG, I would classify it more as an objective-based FPS rather than a death match FPS hence the need for a respawn timer. (just elaborating on your point, is all)
abortretryfail: You know, I played Battlefield a few times and I thought it was a decent game.
In summary of my position, this is not some radical new idea. It is a basic concept present in all games in which one [group of] player[s] wants something that another [group of] player[s] also wants where that something would be an object or territory aside from frags.
So you spawn instantly, but can't launch till timer expires, so you can at least do stuff in the station bar/commerce/etc.
Yeah, why no, just another sort of delay.
Yeah, why no, just another sort of delay.
@Drazed:
You did not read post. All station interface remains operational. Only adds a timer above it. And the 20 or 30sec is less than an average player takes to select and equip a ship. But longer than buy back last ship.
You did not read post. All station interface remains operational. Only adds a timer above it. And the 20 or 30sec is less than an average player takes to select and equip a ship. But longer than buy back last ship.
Battlefield (1942) was a great game, despite the respawn timers. My biggest gripe with them was that the game punished you for doing very well or very poorly by increasing your respawn timer.
VO already has delays for it's objective-based portions. You have to buy a new ship, equip addons, leave the station, fly out 3Km then jump - sometimes through a wormhole, as in the Serco's case in Deneb. The only time there's "quake-style" respawning right into the fray is during combat in station sectors.
Having a huge payout for respawn would just be hurting the newbies who don't have big bank accounts like all you players who've been here for 4 years. :P
VO already has delays for it's objective-based portions. You have to buy a new ship, equip addons, leave the station, fly out 3Km then jump - sometimes through a wormhole, as in the Serco's case in Deneb. The only time there's "quake-style" respawning right into the fray is during combat in station sectors.
Having a huge payout for respawn would just be hurting the newbies who don't have big bank accounts like all you players who've been here for 4 years. :P
VO already has delays for it's objective-based portions. You have to buy a new ship, equip addons, leave the station, fly out 3Km then jump - sometimes through a wormhole, as in the Serco's case in Deneb.
The problem is that the victors likewise have to fly back to a station, rearm and repair (or in the case of pirates or anti-pirates, get a ship with which to salvage stolen cargo, either for sale or return to its original owner), then fly back to the contested area.
60 seconds of pre-launch restriction - during which time you can tweak systems, trade, look at missions, and/or read news - for doing something as dumb as getting yourself killed by another player or during a military combat mission is necessary to give a point to combat victory and a reason to not say 'whatever, blow me up, it'll actually help!' when faced with death.
The problem is that the victors likewise have to fly back to a station, rearm and repair (or in the case of pirates or anti-pirates, get a ship with which to salvage stolen cargo, either for sale or return to its original owner), then fly back to the contested area.
60 seconds of pre-launch restriction - during which time you can tweak systems, trade, look at missions, and/or read news - for doing something as dumb as getting yourself killed by another player or during a military combat mission is necessary to give a point to combat victory and a reason to not say 'whatever, blow me up, it'll actually help!' when faced with death.
Give it a try and see what happens. Discuss & adjust or remove. I remain skeptical, but I understand why its desired. I'll move from against to cautiously neutral.
I hope devs will make something interesting with death soon (tm).
Maybe they will implement it on test server, so PCC members can try different variants.
Maybe they will implement it on test server, so PCC members can try different variants.