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Okay I noticed that there aren't many people that use the big ships for combat.
I believe the issue i sthat with the limited energy supplies the player can't use the ship to its full potential.
So to improve these large ships that are just energy hogs they could have either a natural energy supply to add to the battery or be able to equip multiple batteries.
Now this would make it so that a player can acutally make use of the weaponry on the ragnarok... Considering that the ship has a high fire power capability but it can only reach its potential by using ammo based weapons which means that the ship becomes a excessively large Bus once it is out of ammo.
Now the ragnarok and the Hornet are the ships that primarily experience the problem. So we see more maneuverable ships instead of the big ships with big guns.
Why use a ragnarok when you can use the Warthog or even the Prometheus for the use of large weapons. The warthog has a decent maneuverability and although it has limited ports it is good energy wise and it can use a large weapon... Also it has a mediocre manueverability.
So the larger ships IMO need a tweaking of some sort to allow them to compare to the much faster maneuverable ships.
I believe the issue i sthat with the limited energy supplies the player can't use the ship to its full potential.
So to improve these large ships that are just energy hogs they could have either a natural energy supply to add to the battery or be able to equip multiple batteries.
Now this would make it so that a player can acutally make use of the weaponry on the ragnarok... Considering that the ship has a high fire power capability but it can only reach its potential by using ammo based weapons which means that the ship becomes a excessively large Bus once it is out of ammo.
Now the ragnarok and the Hornet are the ships that primarily experience the problem. So we see more maneuverable ships instead of the big ships with big guns.
Why use a ragnarok when you can use the Warthog or even the Prometheus for the use of large weapons. The warthog has a decent maneuverability and although it has limited ports it is good energy wise and it can use a large weapon... Also it has a mediocre manueverability.
So the larger ships IMO need a tweaking of some sort to allow them to compare to the much faster maneuverable ships.
Agreed, in most part. The Rag is disappointing, given its face-value potential. It was designed as a warship, but any decent weapon loadout leaves it drained or out of ammo. Likewise, the Hornet's ports beg to be filled with high-power energy weapons (I, personally, find rockets and missiles lacking ability in dogfights). What's the point if these ships, designed to be heavy hitters, can only pop out a few shots before having to recharge?
Note: I also think the Warthog could use a bit of a boost in armor and armament, but that's just me (it needs to do justice to the good ol' A-10!).
Note: I also think the Warthog could use a bit of a boost in armor and armament, but that's just me (it needs to do justice to the good ol' A-10!).
I had asked about the Ragnarok in game and well it seems no one uses it... I also asked if it had any use in PVP... THe answer was spamming missles.
So we need some improvement to these ships. Like gear that can only fit on certain size ships. Or perhaps improve the Ragnaroks targeting system and its energy. I would like ot play the big ships but they dont have a proctical use over the more maneuverable ships.
But overall I am happy with the warthog... Albeit I still think that the Centurion Rev C is scarey as hell.
I wouldnt mind seeing some new variants to the Warthog... I think it is perfectly fine on firepower... The armor I spose could be altered... But I would rather see an lighter variant of the ship by perhaps removing all the cargo and the small weapon for increased agility. A larger verson of the ship would be really cool as well. But adding mroe ports will make it to similiar to other ships.
So we need some improvement to these ships. Like gear that can only fit on certain size ships. Or perhaps improve the Ragnaroks targeting system and its energy. I would like ot play the big ships but they dont have a proctical use over the more maneuverable ships.
But overall I am happy with the warthog... Albeit I still think that the Centurion Rev C is scarey as hell.
I wouldnt mind seeing some new variants to the Warthog... I think it is perfectly fine on firepower... The armor I spose could be altered... But I would rather see an lighter variant of the ship by perhaps removing all the cargo and the small weapon for increased agility. A larger verson of the ship would be really cool as well. But adding mroe ports will make it to similiar to other ships.
The hog just needs its roll back...
To the topic at hand,
The Hornet and Rag do have their uses...
But they are useless in a 1v1 PvP, group efforts? a Rag or flare spammin/rail/energy spamming hornet could come in, what we need are more reasons to use them, Soon(tm)....
To the topic at hand,
The Hornet and Rag do have their uses...
But they are useless in a 1v1 PvP, group efforts? a Rag or flare spammin/rail/energy spamming hornet could come in, what we need are more reasons to use them, Soon(tm)....
I use a Rag III for all hostile activities. My 5 duel wins were while flying one.
http://vendetta-online.com/x/duelstats/57935/
I also have good results in CtC with it.
http://vendetta-online.com/x/duelstats/57935/
I also have good results in CtC with it.
how did you get that information? I wanna find out my character ID number
By clicking your name on the ranking page.
Consider that two batteries would allow for sustianed turbo. You would have to double the energy consumption of turbo to bring that into balance. Unless you also totaled the recharge rates together, the ship would be at handicap when turboing, as it would not be able to rebuild a charge fast enough to keep up with anything. Allowing both a battery's capacity and rechare rate to be totaled would allow for awsome weapons capacity (which is the point of these ships right?) and would also allow turbo to continue to work at the rates intended if consumption is doubled.
Another idea could be to give the ships a special ability to reduce weapon energy needs by 0.75~0.5. A more conservative reduction of cost (0.75) might be needed to prevent any potential total überness, but would be interesting to see what effect a greater margin could have.
Another idea could be to give the ships a special ability to reduce weapon energy needs by 0.75~0.5. A more conservative reduction of cost (0.75) might be needed to prevent any potential total überness, but would be interesting to see what effect a greater margin could have.
Pfft! The rag is good as is. I load it out with a gattling turret, 3 missiles, and a mine dropper. I don't have to spam. To the best of my knowledge, the devs have no plans to support more than one battery per ship.
Let us try to get away from the mindset that every single ship should be able to hold its own against every other ship in 1:1 PvP. The rag could figure prominently in taking down a cap ship, both as a missile platform and a mobile repair ship.
Let us try to get away from the mindset that every single ship should be able to hold its own against every other ship in 1:1 PvP. The rag could figure prominently in taking down a cap ship, both as a missile platform and a mobile repair ship.
hmmm.... Well I was at least making an attempt at trying to get the Bigger ships to be more useful.
The main issue was that the large ships would typically burn thorugh energy or ammo just trying to fight most ships.
I would really liek to see a ragnarok win against a Rev C or even a Vulture.
I am a fan of the big ships but they simply dont survive against the smaller ships.
Even te gatling turret has its tough times with the Rev C. So a ship that can't manuever fast enough would get picked apart very quickly.
The Rag could manage itself against a Frigate but w/o others distracting the weapon fire from the Frigate the Rag will be destroyed relatively quickly. Big ships can habdle big ships but smaller agile ships can handle any ship so we see a lot of the Rev C ships flying around as they are hard to hit.
I dont think the Rag will be effective in Cap ship fights simply because the Rag is in itself is just a barely mobile weapons platform. So once the Rag is out of ammo it simply has the energy weapon to fight with and would most likely be killed before that time since it cant manuever away from the weapons fire.
The main issue was that the large ships would typically burn thorugh energy or ammo just trying to fight most ships.
I would really liek to see a ragnarok win against a Rev C or even a Vulture.
I am a fan of the big ships but they simply dont survive against the smaller ships.
Even te gatling turret has its tough times with the Rev C. So a ship that can't manuever fast enough would get picked apart very quickly.
The Rag could manage itself against a Frigate but w/o others distracting the weapon fire from the Frigate the Rag will be destroyed relatively quickly. Big ships can habdle big ships but smaller agile ships can handle any ship so we see a lot of the Rev C ships flying around as they are hard to hit.
I dont think the Rag will be effective in Cap ship fights simply because the Rag is in itself is just a barely mobile weapons platform. So once the Rag is out of ammo it simply has the energy weapon to fight with and would most likely be killed before that time since it cant manuever away from the weapons fire.
I'll be on after 10:00pm PST (as Sherpa). What's your name in-game? We'll get together and I'll show you how effective the rag can be.
bigger turbo thrust would be welcome to make the rag more useable. From time to time I bring one into battle too and love it. I've done some serious damage with my good old ragIII (loadout classified ;). Only problem is, from the moment someone gets the chance to stay close, its done, and boosting out for a few 100 meters is out of the question.
it just so happens i was in a rag yesterday. i had 2 gat turrets and 3 neut 2s. i had just won a duel having only 12% health left. the duel was quite fun and did last way too long, but the really sad part was that I was down to 12% dueling an..
EC-98!
the pilot was a certain UBER dueler, and he really should have won due to his skills.
My point in this is that a bus kicked the pants off of a rag. That just shouln't be.
Solution: simple, create a better battery than the Fast Charge.
Make it a high level item (not the 5,000 mentor point ubercharge battery), but make it! PLEASE! I'll add sugar if it'll help.
EC-98!
the pilot was a certain UBER dueler, and he really should have won due to his skills.
My point in this is that a bus kicked the pants off of a rag. That just shouln't be.
Solution: simple, create a better battery than the Fast Charge.
Make it a high level item (not the 5,000 mentor point ubercharge battery), but make it! PLEASE! I'll add sugar if it'll help.
That's not a very good configuration for the rag at all.
If they DID make it so that the rag could power all of those weapons, then people would complain that: 1) The rag can't manuever to bring all those weapons to bear quickly enough and needs more agility, or 2) that the rag is an over-powered uber death machine.
Again, to some degree we have to adapt to the different ships specs and find the configurations that work best for a given task. Some ships require different or more skills than others.
If you see me (Sherpa) in-game, you bring your EC-98 and I'll bring my rag.
If they DID make it so that the rag could power all of those weapons, then people would complain that: 1) The rag can't manuever to bring all those weapons to bear quickly enough and needs more agility, or 2) that the rag is an over-powered uber death machine.
Again, to some degree we have to adapt to the different ships specs and find the configurations that work best for a given task. Some ships require different or more skills than others.
If you see me (Sherpa) in-game, you bring your EC-98 and I'll bring my rag.
Yeah your probably right about that.
I do agree that every ship shouldnt be able to fight and win against every other ship w/o havign lots of skill but the ships need a better chance at times and it shouldnt be as easy to bring down such a large heavily armored ship.
Well altering the ration of armor to mass ratio would help to an extent since it would mean that the agile ships cant handle getting hit so but the ragnarok still will have trouble hitting.
Well another option would be to lower the range of smaller weapons and/or increase the range of larger weapons (I think a little of both would be best). It seems that the ranges on the weapons are basically the same as the small weapons (besides missles really). The fastest and longest range weapon is a small weapon. The Rail Cannon has a high damage as well, albeit it has some balance since it has no auto-targeting.
The only other defensive system I can really think up for a larger ship is a Drone system would be effective for dfense.
I do agree that every ship shouldnt be able to fight and win against every other ship w/o havign lots of skill but the ships need a better chance at times and it shouldnt be as easy to bring down such a large heavily armored ship.
Well altering the ration of armor to mass ratio would help to an extent since it would mean that the agile ships cant handle getting hit so but the ragnarok still will have trouble hitting.
Well another option would be to lower the range of smaller weapons and/or increase the range of larger weapons (I think a little of both would be best). It seems that the ranges on the weapons are basically the same as the small weapons (besides missles really). The fastest and longest range weapon is a small weapon. The Rail Cannon has a high damage as well, albeit it has some balance since it has no auto-targeting.
The only other defensive system I can really think up for a larger ship is a Drone system would be effective for dfense.
I think you just need more practice PvPing in a Rag. I know I do.
Three brief things:
1) We want to expand the Large Port module selection. I hope to balance this with large individual module mass that will favor their use on the heavier (and more thrust-capable) ships.
2) I've been rolling around the possibility of a very high-mass battery that also gives more energy storage, in combination with the above expansion of large-port addons. The concept being that it would make various heavy weapons use possible, but with the added expense of significant mass.
3) The heavy ships are not meant to match up to the pure fighters in a maneuverability situation. The Prometheus SkyCommand and the Centaur Aggresso are the furthest this has been taken, and by many accounts, the SkyCommand can be a bit over the top. I think it's perfectly reasonable for heavy ships to fill out a different role from purist fighters, a role we can expand as we add more Large Port possibilities to choose from.
1) We want to expand the Large Port module selection. I hope to balance this with large individual module mass that will favor their use on the heavier (and more thrust-capable) ships.
2) I've been rolling around the possibility of a very high-mass battery that also gives more energy storage, in combination with the above expansion of large-port addons. The concept being that it would make various heavy weapons use possible, but with the added expense of significant mass.
3) The heavy ships are not meant to match up to the pure fighters in a maneuverability situation. The Prometheus SkyCommand and the Centaur Aggresso are the furthest this has been taken, and by many accounts, the SkyCommand can be a bit over the top. I think it's perfectly reasonable for heavy ships to fill out a different role from purist fighters, a role we can expand as we add more Large Port possibilities to choose from.
Here's my big question: How are you planning on dealing with energy in Capital Ships? Ain't no way no how they can work with the single-battery energy system & batteries we have today. I can think of several ways that could work, but I'd like to know what the devs are planning.
Mmm. Devish replies.
beolach:
electronicsslots that diminish energyusage, bigger frigateclass batteries (seems strange to put a fighterbattery in a frigate like putting an audi a2 motor in an audi a8).
Incarnate: have you ever thought in stead of balancing ships by giving them more agility or armor of giving them a specific armortype that reduces the damage to a smaller level or even renders them invulnerable to that weapon. Like making frigs completely undamageable by any of the small port weapons opening up the role of the heavy ships to a bomber. Decreasing the effect of smaller ports damagewise on the armor of the bigger ships. Effectively making it take way longer for a rev-c to take out a prom but make it go down way faster if battling a wraith or a warthog or even a ragnorok due to the other ports. Maybe even introducing medium ports to add to this diversity and give hornets a 2 small - 2 medium port version maybe even a 3 mediumù port version and then making it possible for these ships to be very susceptible to any damage but able to dish out reduced damage to light ships and max damage to heavy ships. just like in rts you have pierced damage, normal damage, siege damage, hero damage and each having their own specific ability to counter another ship. Although never be impossible to take out the other person if you are so skillfull that you can dodge the other persons weapons but are handicapped because of your reduced damage. Same as using magic in rpgs on fighters and using thiefs on magicusers and using fighters on on thiefs... It might help a lot in balancing each class out with each other. In a rpg sense.
PS incarnate: and you did probably thijk about it, im sure :D. Just tossing it in again to hope that you give every ship its own distinctive feel in heavyness but give them other means to withstand some ships and actually open the game to all options in stead of the prevalent scp and the rev-c.
cheers
electronicsslots that diminish energyusage, bigger frigateclass batteries (seems strange to put a fighterbattery in a frigate like putting an audi a2 motor in an audi a8).
Incarnate: have you ever thought in stead of balancing ships by giving them more agility or armor of giving them a specific armortype that reduces the damage to a smaller level or even renders them invulnerable to that weapon. Like making frigs completely undamageable by any of the small port weapons opening up the role of the heavy ships to a bomber. Decreasing the effect of smaller ports damagewise on the armor of the bigger ships. Effectively making it take way longer for a rev-c to take out a prom but make it go down way faster if battling a wraith or a warthog or even a ragnorok due to the other ports. Maybe even introducing medium ports to add to this diversity and give hornets a 2 small - 2 medium port version maybe even a 3 mediumù port version and then making it possible for these ships to be very susceptible to any damage but able to dish out reduced damage to light ships and max damage to heavy ships. just like in rts you have pierced damage, normal damage, siege damage, hero damage and each having their own specific ability to counter another ship. Although never be impossible to take out the other person if you are so skillfull that you can dodge the other persons weapons but are handicapped because of your reduced damage. Same as using magic in rpgs on fighters and using thiefs on magicusers and using fighters on on thiefs... It might help a lot in balancing each class out with each other. In a rpg sense.
PS incarnate: and you did probably thijk about it, im sure :D. Just tossing it in again to hope that you give every ship its own distinctive feel in heavyness but give them other means to withstand some ships and actually open the game to all options in stead of the prevalent scp and the rev-c.
cheers