In RP there is a certain amount of guild chest thumping and trashing that could legitimately be seen as role-play. I really don't see that as a problem unless it gets into personal attacks and RL stuff. It can be a bit of a gray area, but those are the guidelines I'm given.

I like that we don't have Disney-like oppression here, but I do wish all users would appreciate the freedoms they have here - and would demonstrate this by avoiding asshattery.

I'm stall waiting to hear what others will change to foster the community. There seemed to be lots of criticism for my closing the previous thread, but then very little else came of this curated thread.

Okay, I'll start Whistler:

I pledge to never use or seek anyone's personal info, unless you name your character/account after yourself, and then I only will call you by the name you've given me.

I also pledge to only respond to other people doing so on my threads by calling them out and telling them to stop.
-Nith

*Edit: oh and I won't post a paragraph containing nothing but the bracketed words "redacted" or "by" or "Whistler" coupled by random nouns, verbs, and player names anymore. Despite finding it funny.

I'm not sure how levelling negative mischaracterizations of me helps anything here, rin. You really jumping on the short bus of taunting me in plain sight of whistler?

Taunting you is okay to do, I hope you're okay with that.

Using the term "Short bus" as you just did, has the potential collateral negative effects that I believe are trying to be addressed in this thread.

I know for a fact that there are people who read these forums, unrelated to any of this that have disabilities that may lead to them not feeling to great by what you just said.

I don't see how taunting me, or any specific individual for that matter, should be ok in a thread like this.

"Short bus" was a term I utilized to show that some people appear to have learning disabilities that prevent them from holding their fucking tongue in situations that require it.

Wow, greenwall is really easily offended by the word "deceit." Come on, everyone lies on average of 25 times a day. Deceit doesn't make you weird or abnormal.

I agree it would be more productive in this post to not do any of that.

Can you honestly not understand that there are people who have special needs relatives that they have to explain to all the time how ugly most of the real world can be, as well as special needs players, who might want a place where they don't need to feel singled out and or negativity reflected upon.

I know I might seem a hair sensitive on the topic. But since I DO see you as an intelligent person, I expect better from you.

I was not taunting you in this instance. It was merely a clinical statement of fact. How do you expect to have a discussion about changing behavior to make the forum better if we cannot even discuss what it is we wish changed?

On the off-chance that this was an honest misunderstanding and you truly believed that was a taunt, consider "repair mode" engaged. I do not apologize for truthfully stating what I dislike about your behavior, but I do apologize if you perceived that as a taunt. It was not meant to be a taunt (unlike my comment in the other hatefulness thread, which was a taunt -- you may want to examine the difference to avoid future misunderstandings).

Man this thread is depressing...

Anyone that doesn't appreciate VO having a forum moderator must have never experienced a forum without a decent moderator.

Of course two random people won't always agree with how to handle certain situations. And of course when one of those people is the forum moderator and the other is not, the one that is not will likely feel a bit screwed over. I think it is obvious though that it wasn't anyone's intention of screwing the other over.

And I mean that going both ways.

This thread was created with good intentions, not bad. The last thread was closed with good intentions, not bad. Can we at least agree to this?

If someone is in the mood to troll on the forums it is as easy as making a throw away account and trolling. Nothing can stop this. There's tons of ways of getting around any system that one may think would catch these sorts of actions. That's just a fact.

And to be completely honest, in my opinion, if someone is trolling someone else about in-game shit, who cares. Like an Itani newb being harassed by a Serco vet about being Itani or vica versa. Fair game in my opinion. Keep in mind this is only my opinion, but if that Serco player smears the Itani player's personality and character within the context of in-game, then that Itani player should stand up for himself. I used this particular example because it is a great example of in-game racism.

You cross the line as soon as you start trolling about RL things. Doesn't matter the context. You cross the line at that moment. (if someone would like and example I'll gladly give a few, just ask)

I personally have chosen to RP a character that doesn't acknowledge that race exists in-game, nor acknowledge that my guild has any conflict with anyone. Because in our heads we are friends to all and any offense that any of our members make reflects them as an individual and not us as a guild. Like I said before that's just my opinion.

This game is so f-ing fun to play, and I think everyone still reading this post would agree. Can we all at least agree to that as well?

If you've agreed with me on the points that I've made, then I just want to ask another question. Can we all see when someone is actually trolling and having fun within the context of the game, and when someone is actually crossing a line?

I mean, come on, seriously think about it. We pretty much all know each other. I have pretty much become personal friends with everyone I've come across in the game, whether we use our character names or not. It is very obvious to me when someone is actually talking about RL things. In those circumstances, those people have crossed the line in my opinion.

It is such a simple thing to realize.

So does that mean that every time someone crosses the line they will be policed? Uhhh no. That's ridiculous. The devs and the mods are gods and there aren't any games that get this 100% right. That's just a fact of life as well. If you don't like the level at which the devs and mods police these things then bring it up in a support ticket and if they don't respond or you don't feel like you were given enough attention then go ahead and blow it out your ass.

This really shows how committed people are to this game, and that kinda makes me happy. But then I just can't help but notice the toxic waste that some are willing fling in a moment's notice. Stop crossing RL lines guys. It is seriously that simple.

And damn you all for making me feel like typing and posting this ridiculously stupid and long f-ing post.

HAVE A NICE F-ING DAY!!!

Well put all the same Darth, agree 100%

Agreed.

@rin

I was not taunting you in this instance. It was merely a clinical statement of fact. How do you expect to have a discussion about changing behavior to make the forum better if we cannot even discuss what it is we wish changed?

Singling me out and calling me deceitful is not a clinical statement of fact, it is a provocative and unfounded criticism and generalization that you long have had festering in your bowels that almost entirely exists as a result of your own misunderstanding of debates we've had in the past and that you refuse (due to personality conflicts, I presume) to let go of. Grow the f- up dude. I have plenty of criticisms of my own about you and others that I feel are "clinical statements of fact" that I have avoided getting into here because it's not productive. The plea of this topic is to TONE IT THE F-DOWN. You are a smart guy, I'm sure you can understand how you are NOT doing that.

@Darth

I agree with all you just said. However, I also feel this thread is pretty much pointless, and I hold out no hope or expectation that others will adjust. I'll give it another go though, as I've said.

Number of times Greenwall has said the word "f-" or variations in this thread = 4

It's not real helpful in toning things down.

General Behavioural Guidelines, Across All Forums

- Keep Language to PG-13. Avoid foul language. This should be self-explanatory. If you break the rule, a guide or administrator may edit your post to censor it. Consider this act a warning, and avoid repeating this in the future.

The atmosphere that has spawned this thread is not surprising. Disappointing, but not surprising. In many ways it resembles the political forum I frequent. Name calling and insults are elevated to a high art form there, as well as here. I myself frequently fall victim to the urge to let loose and have delivered many a written insult and tirades. But I'm here to tell you friends: that energy stays with you. Like a bad case of heartburn, it will persist and slowly poison your perception.

But if you care not for your spiritual health or doubt the truth of my words, remember it's just a game. It's suppose to be fun. And I guess to some extent flaming somebody on the forums does deliver a certain satisfaction; but is it really worth it? In any case, there's a fine line between banter and tirade. After a certain amount of back and forth somebody has to be the adult and walk away. When all that can be said has said, just walk away.

That's all I have.

I disagree with that point.

I used a literal shit-ton of "foul language", and I think my post served to calm things down on the thread better than anyone else's post.

But I get where you're coming from and will abstain from such behavior in the future. Consider that my contribution to make the 'verse and forums and better place.

And like I said, thanks for doing what you do because without moderators these forums wouldn't only go to shit, it would get hacked to pieces.

Whoops! I did it again! Last time I swear!

Thanks!

It's always hard to find the line with profanity on what is essentially an international forum. Words that are innocuous in the US are quite rude elsewhere, and vice versa. Incarnate referenced PG-13, but even that is rather subjective and relies on mitigating and exacerbating factors. My usual line is whether the profanity is directed AT someone, though that is not the posted rule. I chose to edit here since it was brought to our attention. I think people waste profanity by using it casually, and have to escalate beyond profanity in order to feel forceful.