Complains have been made by members of TRI to council members of ITAN, for example Zok and Harpo, but nothing is done about Estrian Prosis attacking TRI members. I'm guessing TRI is not the only trade guild receiving this treatment. Today I was travelling in a loaded moth through Sedina and was attacked by a member of a friendly guild.

[Mon Aug 17 01:32:05 2015] You are entering Sedina L-2
Estrian Prosis: Entered the sector
Estrian Prosis: Left the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:32:39 2015] People in the room: Hakashis Sholus
[Mon Aug 17 01:32:39 2015] You are now in Daltas Hold (Xang Xi Barracks).
[Mon Aug 17 01:33:33 2015] You are entering Sedina B-8
Estrian Prosis: Entered the sector
baxterthecrafter2.0: Entered the sector
Arlathis JoHaun: Entered the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:33:45 2015] <Estrian Prosis> lol
[Mon Aug 17 01:33:48 2015] <Estrian Prosis> murder
[Mon Aug 17 01:33:58 2015] Flight-Assist mode disabled.
Painted Black: Entered the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:01 2015] <Arlathis JoHaun> Ran out of missle
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:06 2015] Estrian Prosis destroyed Hakashis Sholus
Estrian Prosis: Left the sector
baxterthecrafter2.0: Left the sector
Arlathis JoHaun: Left the sector
Painted Black: Left the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:09 2015] You are entering Sedina L-2
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:11 2015] People in the room: Hakashis Sholus
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:11 2015] You are now in Daltas Hold (Xang Xi Barracks).
[Mon Aug 17 01:34:37 2015] ->Estrian Prosis: Why the unprovoked attack?
[Mon Aug 17 01:35:30 2015] ->Estrian Prosis: Why the unprovoked attack?
[Mon Aug 17 01:37:27 2015] ->Estrian Prosis: Why the unprovoked attack?
Estrian Prosis: Entered the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:38:58 2015] Estrian Prosis has entered the room.
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:06 2015] Estrian Prosis has left the room.
Estrian Prosis: Left the sector
Estrian Prosis: Entered the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:07 2015] (guild) [Sedina L-2] <Hakashis Sholus> and he's not responding to my request for an explanation
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:14 2015] ->Estrian Prosis: Why the unprovoked attack?
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:21 2015] *Estrian Prosis* because moth
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:35 2015] *Estrian Prosis* and serco
Estrian Prosis: Left the sector
[Mon Aug 17 01:39:59 2015] ->Estrian Prosis: TRI member, but you know that

Obviously Estrian Prosis doesn't care about arrangements or agreements between guilds. I want to know ITAN's policy regarding this sort of incident and what will be done about it. I see members of ITAN demanding as much from other guilds here in the forum.

War Criminals such as SKV Niki and Itan Estrian Prosis are known to attack civilian targets.
No Itani Nationalist should be trusted.
Call on channel 11 for help or for enemy monitoring.

Red Shards Klan Squadron Leader.
End of transmission.

Or ye could hire some gray folks to hunt him down fer a few couple of millions.
@X, CSBM, even FAMY i guess, would be glad to earn a few creds and enjoy the gank party.

Red Shards? Only one name in the guild list looks familiar. Is this yet another Serco nationalist guild? What do we have now, four Serco nationalist guilds each with 1 or 2 active members? Merge and you could do some damage. Too bad you can't stand each other.

I still see about 3 FAMY members in a week. My guess is not enough to bother EP.

CSBM does what exactly? I guess I'll go read up on them.

I havn't seen a member of @X lately.

Complain to me all you like. I pass them on, usually. You would be better off going to coalitionofitan.com and state your complaint in the diplomatic section, the high ranking officers will see it as well as the regular members.

Interesting. And if you could kindly point me in the general direction where Itan and TRI have an agreement then I might be bothered to give a shit. Otherwise you're just as much a target as an unguilded player.

Tell me, what's Hakashis Sholus' Itani standing? Would the NPC Itani war convoy have done the same thing? What about the border guards at Jallik?

Neutral traders are expected to maintain neutral standings if they wish to be taken seriously. Enemy militants will not be allowed to supply the Serco war effort that slaughters millions of Itani on the Deneb front under the flag of "Don't shoot! I'm a trader!"

-ARF
Commander of The Coalition of Itan

There is no serco war effort, hence the shooting of innocents by Itani nationalists.

@ARF:

I am allowed in Itani space, my credit score there is low but accepted.

As an ex member of TRI, Hakashi Sholus has no right to speak on behalf of our guild.

WE DO NOT MAKE FORUM POSTS TO WHINE ABOUT PEOPLE SHOOTING OUR MOTHS.

This thread is wrong on so many levels. How about we go play the game and let this ninny thread die like the rest of the ninny threads on the RP section.

I just check the guild list, it looks like I've been removed from TRI. Thanks Darth. Is 'expel' always the first reaction?

Thank you all for reading, but: never mind

There is no serco war effort, hence the shooting of innocents by Itani nationalists.

Those 'innocents' should have considered that when they stood against the Serco nationalists last time around.

TRI member gets frustrated and demands to be heard, TRI boots him/her out for complaining publicly. At least when INV recently kicked their misbehaving member out he had actually performed an action. In the game. And I thought *that* was a stupid reason to boot someone.

Yuk yuk yuk.

TGFT has a councilor run amok and they won't even apologize. Opposite ends of the spectrum. Trade guilds seem to be no balls or no brains.

So Darth, should [ITAN] boot me for the stupid shit I say in here? I think they have been very tolerant. A couple of times over the years I was asked politely to reign it in a bit, and I've been a member since the guild was founded. They've shown me respect and I try to give it back. You don't seem to respect your members so why should anyone else? TGFT, other faults aside, was loyal to their troublesome councilor. I would think some VO players will find it liberating to know that TRI leadership is not going to lift a finger when their member's ships are destroyed. I suspect you'll just boot them too if they complain too loudly. You've set a precedent now, and it's an idiotic one. It suggests that you're not ready to be a commander.

Perhaps Harpo, but one kill does not warrant a huge ragethread on the forums. If I was griefing him, sure, but I wasn't. It shows a rather transparent disrespect for their leadership and diplomacy to get it resolved.

If he had not lost it and taken his butthurt ass here to the forums to have a cry about being killed, he probably would have found Darth approaching me about it had he used the proper channels. But he didn't, so here we are.

There are no griefers in VO. If you see one, you should kill it.

You have no idea the history that has gone on internally, nor will you, because we don't go around spreading our internal drama all over the forums. Considering that, I think you have no place to comment on TRI's actions for the given situation. So, I can see why ITAN has asked in the past to tone it back on the forums. Seems like you speak before you have any real knowledge of a situation.

And for your information, this wasn't a decision I made alone.

Apart from that, ITAN is a warring guild. Starting ruckus and drama on the RP forums seems appropriate and really fun.

TRI on the other hand, is the most neutral and active guild in the game. I'm not going to let the actions of one member, who should have known better, affect our newer members, who have absolutely no desire for combat or conflict.

Furthermore, I am disappointed that you, a person in which I thought there was mutual respect, would make such a statement.

But in the end, Kierky said it best. If Hakashis Sholus would have first discussed it with me, I would have then discussed it with EP, and the two would have probably squashed everything.

The fact of the matter is, as a member of TRI, we are called upon to be something bigger than a butthurtful, attention-seeking ninny. We must make wise and prudent decisions for the sake of our less experienced members. Some say that the point of this game is combat, but that is so far from the truth. What TRI looks to provide is a way to learn and play the game, having fun, making friends, and not starting shit.

In my opinion this game needs a guild like TRI, or else every newb that comes along will just get wrecked into quitting.

We are single-handedly responsible for the subbing of at least 10 players. These players would have probably quit the game had they not found TRI. I think this is a sign that I am doing something right as CO of TRI.

Have a nice day bud. Seems like it started rather shitty for you.

Yarrr TRI! pay i 100millions or i start killin' all yer moths.

lol everyone just relax and drop mines at wh's along default paths, the game will be so much better.

Neutral doesn't mean you have to continously tolerate people shooting you. This (being shot by Estrian and other "nationalists") is something that TRI will have to put up with indefinitely... and they will either have to continue to bend over and take it, or fight back. Those are the two options. I suspect that, for the time being, bending over and taking it is TRI policy (along with not airing grievances publicly). To be fair, if you have a wholly non-combative, newb-centric guild, bending over and taking it is pretty much your only option.

People say that TGFT hasn't been neutral, but they are mistaken. There is such a thing as "armed neutrality", which basically means they prefer to stay out of all conflicts, but if they are attacked they will fight back. While Harpo pointed out there was an issue with a TGFT councilor (which is not in dispute), he has long since left TGFT all together. Not that it wouldn't be "nice" to have an apology of some sorts to the wounded parties (who, honestly, have also probably long quit VO) -- but opponents are treating TGFT like they actively condone and support the misbehavior of said councilor, which is obviously not the case.

i don't understand all the arguing. the system of VO players is quite easy. conversations like this shouldn't go on. let me explain to you the 4 most common categories of players in VO.

1. there will always be loose cannons in VO and espcially loudmouthed loose cannons in VO. estrian prosis is such a guy. he talks a lot of shit on 100 AND the forums but he can back it up with guns since hes a decent pvper. hate these guys as much as you want. they'll stay.

2. then theres these guys who are trying not to be loose cannons. we'll call them the "politician combatants" who love to follow their agenda. if you look closer they love combat just as much like them loose cannons and they will happily get into silly arguments on 100. they try to stay out of the forums and if they ever post they try to be all official. sieger is a perfect example for this. he can back his shit with guns just as ep. its kinda funny: they have more in common as they may like. they are both among the top PvPers in the game and like to argue just as much ;-P maybe they should consider marriage.

3. then there is the type of player we call "forums whiner". good examples for this are TRS, harpo (csgno), Kopia Onol, Dr. Lecter and on special situation our one and only ARF. these guys are not great PvPers. not at all. and they know it. if these fellas ever log in they play Deneb, hide in their Trident or do other "important programmer stuff". they'll question any of your ideas and posts. they'll break supposed "friendships" by suddenly shooting in your back with a harsh comment. they'l be there and talk and talk and talk but when it comes to backing it up with pew pews then that ain't gonna happen (unless you let them bring their Trident!!!)

4. now to the last cetgory - the "neutral nodders". you may know what is about to come. our man darth nihilus is the best active proof for this. these guys will do anything to stay out of major shit and if it is to kick their own people cause a loose cannon category guy started shit again. they'll happily parade their neutrality they bought with their bowing and nodding. but tell ya what: this isn't gonna be persistent forever. it's sorta like physics: they are like they are and follow your begging set of rules. the loose cannons will shoot these guys as much as they nod and take it :-P

now its up to you folks. who do you think of these groups has the most fun at this game?

Hmm, wonder who's alt this is.

"then there is the type of player we call "forums whiner". good examples for this are TRS, harpo (csgno), Kopia Onol, Dr. Lecter and on special situation our one and only ARF."

Strange, I very rarely post on the forums.