Forums » Suggestions

Capship turret porposal, Caprails & PCB turret

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Apr 15, 2022 Whistler link
I edited a post to comply with Rule #3.
Apr 17, 2022 We all float link
buggy turrets that are practically impossible to destroy if someone's running one of those turret swapping plugins
There is no plugin to undestroy turrets. Currently if a player takes control of their ship, the turrets come back. Turret swapping is possible, but it disables the turret and shields for five minutes.

Capships are broken, everyone knows it and no one knows how to fix it

That is because they are not broken. They are working as they are supposed to. The current implementation of capital ships makes them incredibly vulnerable non capships. Instead of trying to fight capships with a capship, fight capships with bombers and light fighters. You will win almost every time.

The turrets are there to keep a 1 or 2 fighters off. They are defensive only.

A fair fix might just be to make caprails draw a similar amount of energy to regular rails and lowering the ammo count

Cap rails already use energy. If a fighter pcbs a capship that has rails or capswarms, the cap ship is dead in the water. Easy to kill.

Video showing proof of a cap rail using energy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WD61heybx8
Apr 17, 2022 greenwall link
If a fighter pcbs a capship that has rails or capswarms, the cap ship is dead in the water. Easy to kill.


That's not true. It's pretty easy to produce enough occasional disruptions to PCB attacks (by turning or using non energy turrets) to allow the very teensy amount of time needed for a battery to charge up a caprail shot. Many capable pilots in X1s have been sniped away this way by ActivateTurrets.
Apr 19, 2022 csgno1 link
@greenwall

No, I'm not looking for ways to chase down capships with capships, just the opposite. I want them rushing at each other fighting up close, not 3k meters away. They stay apart because of the PCB turret. Pilots don't commit to up-close fighting because of it.

@LNH

The PCB turret does not need increased range, I would like the turret version to go away. It stops the fighting. If a goli gets a PCB lock on a trident and both ships still have shields, the fight degrades to waiting to see whos friends show up first. If anything the power requirements to fire a PCB turret should go up.

The current method for killing a capship often involves incapacitating it with a PCB. It's not a very satisfying victory. It's kind of like winning against a guy because someone held him from behind.
May 06, 2022 csgno1 link
Well, I've been thinking about it and I keep coming to the same conclusion, that both the PCB turret and the rail turret should go. And not to remove one without removing the other.
May 06, 2022 dethtag link
I really didn't want to say anything about this topic but, honestly here I am, I'd like to point out csgo1 you use 2 caprails and capgauss on your dent, on the regular, you want a capship brawls, okay first question: how would a Goliath fight a trident without caprails? How would a trident deshield another trident with just capgauss? Same goes for a Goliath. And removing PCB turrets how would that benefit vendetta capships battles? Removing caprails and pcb turrets is your only solution. Why can't you think about having more capital class turrets added? Why is limiting the only capital weapons we currently have your solution? Plus are we only supposed to have a pcb blaater on a small fighter to stop a enemy from leaving the battle? What makes you think we need less? Why not more? Is nurfing All you think about? Making the game virtually a paint ball match? What would the point in playing if we have a extremely low amount of variety of loadouts for capships? With respect, adapt, improvise, and overcome. Sincerely dethtag. Also we need bigger guns for our capital ships.
May 06, 2022 Whistler link
I edited a post to comply with the rules for this forum.
May 06, 2022 demnicat link
Well, I've been thinking about it and I keep coming to the same conclusion, that both the PCB turret and the rail turret should go. And not to remove one without removing the other.
Heh -1
May 06, 2022 Anewold link
good thing is i bearly use rails for much so /shrug
May 06, 2022 csgno1 link
dethtag, good questions.

I use cap rails because they are the best turret for de-shielding at distance. A trident can de-shield another using the default neut2 turrets, but we know what happens now when capships get close; the one with the PCB turret dominates.

Capital cannons are popular because they don't use energy, so are good for unratz and shooting at un-shielded or de-shielded ships. They are not good for de-shielding on their own. I don't view capital cannons as balance-breaking weapons so I don't often discuss them.

I focus on the cap rail and PCB turrets because they are each powerful to where they must be used.

As far as a Goliath fighting with a Trident, the Goliath is at a disadvantage because of turrets, shields, and power cell. With rails a dent can stay 1k away and beat up a goli until the goli is forced to leave. Without rails the dent would have to get much closer. The two ships go the same speed but the goli turns much faster.
May 07, 2022 Anewold link
maybe u forget that the go.i is the starter taster capship, a dent should always win against a dent that being said it is funny to see ppl rage when u make a dent run in a goli
May 07, 2022 Anewold link
also maybe an idea to this capship v capship what if some sort of engine addons and/or shield addons could be equipped, like shield hp:regen could be like 70:30, or 50:50, or 30:70. u can equip the addon based on what is needed. need to chase ppl equip a faster regen shield, need to blockade equip a hardened shield with lower regen, want the best of both sides use the standard 50:50. the addon moduel could be scaled using a % of the current ship stats, so 50% is standard regen it is now. 25% is half of what it currently is and 75% is a extra half applied, so a dent looking like 30k shield hp faster regen, 40k shieldhp standard base (what it is now) and 50k shield slower regen.

in terms of catching up to a capship make engines function similar by boosting stats by say 3% but uses addition grid todo so. making the capship chasing weaker in defense but better in chasing. doin it in % values should make it easier to balance capships by adjusting the capship stat (base stat with no addons).
i am also aware vo had engins addons ages ago and got confusing with the amount of ships, but maybe a input from inc might clafiry more on this idea.
May 07, 2022 Sid123 link
Why should a dent always win against a goli? Golis are weaker than dents in terms of Armor, shields and firepower, but that doesn't mean you have to make them completely incompetent against a dent. By that logic, a rag should be better than an SVG because it has higher licences. VO is about skill over stats. If goli has weaker shields, Armor and firepower = goli shouldn't be able to kill a dent under any circumstances, then we might as well start playing on a spreadsheet.
May 07, 2022 We all float link
If goli has weaker shields, Armor and firepower = goli shouldn't be able to kill a dent under any circumstances, then we might as well start playing on a spreadsheet.

It really depends on the scenario, but 1v1 (full shields), head on, the trident should win on paper every time. I say on paper, because if the trident has rep turrets and a rep gun in the LP, it is not going to win anything. But in that case, the neither will the goli. Because the goli shouldn't be strong enough to beat the trident.

Some of us are referencing what the devs have already said about the Goliath in previous threads. Last year inc stated

"I don't see why the Goliath needs to have an advantage at all."

Now granted, if the goliath pilot undocked, and popped the trident's shields with a rag, and then maintained pcb from that rag on the trident, while the goliath is ordered to attack with its large port. And the dent died, then yes, the goliath has a win. But now that is a 2v1 scenario.
May 07, 2022 haxmeister link
As a competent PvP goliath pilot I will say this... the typical PvP load out for a goliath will have 2 rail guns for removing shields. This technique can also be used by trident pilots. In fact, because a trident pilot can mount even more of them.. it will have a much more significant advantage. Properly trained or knowledgeable trident pilots DO NOT lose to goliaths, they can only win.

The illusion that there is some type of advantage in PvP by the goliath is just that... an illusion based on circumstance and load out. If you are loaded out for PvP and the other player is not, it will matter little which ship you are in. That being said, a goli CANNOT "catch" a dent, nor can a dent "catch" a goliath. The only way this happens is if you are sitting AFK or completely ignoring an approaching opponent. In these cases, you have made the mistake.. it is not an imbalance issue.

The only thing I see that may need to be tweaked regarding cap ship power is the issue of NPCs like unrats. It is impossible to pass through an unrat sector in a cap ship, particularly a goliath. It would seem that unrats have unlimited battery power to operate their PCB and also have unnatural ability to dodge turret weapon fire.

I wish we would just quit nerfing cap ship weapons. Already the rail gun is almost useless against NPC or small ship. It has been made so inaccurate that even with AA off and using zoom, you can't hardly hit an idle target. It is now useless against anything using a PCB.. This weapon was once the pinnacle of power for a capital class ship, now the only reason to use it is for cap to cap PvP. For god's sake, please leave it alone.
May 09, 2022 csgno1 link
Most trident pilots can go through unratz confidently, there are a few different techniques. I've seen goli pilots do it as well.

I think this thread has run it's course.