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Pure Phone

Mar 16, 2013 KatoZee link
I thought I'd create this as something funny happened tonight whilst paying... I seem to have upset Savet who is in a state of disbelief that I play using a phone... His words of:

"If you play using a phone, I play using a wristwatch!"

followed up by

"I've fought people who use phones before, they don't move like that"

Well here you go feller...

Now not to make this an I told you so post, I'm offering to help anyone else that uses phone only (that's phone no controllers or keyboards). One thing I learned was that there is limited help out there for people wishing to play on their phones, most get told to buy a computer or get a controller. Rather frustrating and I believe I snapped at mowgli a while back for offering advice of that nature to someone asking for help on 100.

This is by no means the communities fault, it's like asking for someone's advice for a job they don't do... I'm not suggesting I do any pvp training as I'm still learning the basics, still struggle dodging missiles and my accuracy is still shaky compared to kopia who can nail you with rails on his tablet.

I'm referring to q&a session on what can help us compete... But the one pluggin I recomend over anything else...

Droid buttons

Be sure to thank the creator, he made it and doesn't even play using a phone.

The reason I post this here is because I'm an android user yet even I don't read that forum much, plus there maybe people like draugauth that don't play on their phones but are able to throw in their advice and general tips of the trade.
Mar 16, 2013 incarnate link
I think it's fantastic that people are building up skillsets on the touchscreen :).

Also, there's strong development value to this kind of feedback. I'd like to enhance the touchscreen defaults, and integrate some of the things people have found helpful. This may eventually come in a completely configurable form (like Droid Buttons), but in the meantime it'd go a long way to just improve initial defaults, or offer a couple of selectable layouts.

I'll also be fascinated to read people's techniques, and I'll post some of my own as soon as I get a little time.
Mar 17, 2013 Lord~spidey link
Ah ha, a gatflare skyprom explains everything.

Skill pffft... I could fly those with a joystick up me arse.
Mar 17, 2013 KatoZee link
I am rather honoured that a dev was the first to reply to this post, before I recieved someone's sexual preferences. Tis a weird fetish you got there spidey, i am better in light ships but the guild i play for has its rules to which i adhere to. I will not detract from your combat ability as I tend to appreciate it when you take the time to come and kill me

(Side note for that notion... Sorry for making you travel to latos the other day just for me to dissapear. My daughter was sick she took priority.)

Anyway on for a development point of view... Here is phone screen shot with certain guild sensitive pluggins removed first:

From a development point of view this is played on the HTC One X international version. The default layouts are fine if people don't want to get anywhere near combat. I will point out a few things I have noticed whilst playing that could improve the default layout, whilst offering a resolution.

1, If you note the location of fire 2 and its proximity to the movement sensor. On a small touchscreen (not sure how it affects tablets) if suffers sensitivity issues when trying to fire. Would need to be very precise or else it would just register as a movement command. You could alternately stop moving and fire though as anyone could agree it would be crazy. To combat this I created the "boom" button to act as my fire 2.

You could relocate your fire 2 to just above your primary fire button which I believe is a reletively easy change.

2, the strafe left and right buttons whilst nice for a token gesture don't fill all the requirements of a strafe in a twitch based combat game.

What you don't see on the screen shot is that using droidbuttons I created a movement sensor exclusively for strafe and overlayed it on the front radar screen. The radar is nice but I've not seen the need to constantly refer to them. You could use this a design note by overlapping the ships movement control over the rear radar map and making your own strafe sensor over the front radar map. This could free up the bottom row for more buttons.

3, if point 2 is implemented that leaves the speed controls just hovering around by themselves.

These could be placed just left of the speed indicator or even do away with them in order to have a swipe system to adjust speed. Though that may create more hassle for players that like to have precision in their speed settings perhaps minners.

That's all that comes to mind for the default layout, as you can see I have a lot more buttons created around that have dual functionality that I will ellude to at another time. As for now my daughter wants my attention.
Mar 17, 2013 yodaofborg link
I've only recently acquired a phone that will run VO, and I have to agree with your point about the fire 2 button. It's placement could be better. My phone is tiny (Galaxy S3 mini), but I'm surprised at how well VO plays on it.

As a PC player, it's taking some time to get used to the controls, and rolling with tilt feels alien. I haven't got a single player kill using my phone yet! I do feel like cheating and pulling out a controller, but I really do want to get a few kills on touch screen only, just so I can say "hah, pwned you with my phone!"

I also agree that maybe swiping the speed indicator would be a good way of changing speed, but this will only work with flight assist turned on, and would leave you without the possibility of going backwards.

Also I haven't got around to trying droid buttons yet, but it sounds like I should.
Mar 17, 2013 TheRedSpy link
It's not RED policy that you have to fly a gat/flare prom - but from a learning combat perspective we told shin that he should aim to perfect that loadout first because it gives the confidence to move on to more difficult ones and teaches important principles.

It's no secret though that gats make android combat much more bearable - it's one of the reasons they probably aren't going anywhere hehe.
Mar 17, 2013 KatoZee link
Ah I probably should have elaborated on that content, if it was not for the persistance of the members from RED I would be flying around in a swarm rag serving no other purpose than irritating people and depriving the exilliration of intense PvP dogfighting.

The gat prom allows me to practice on one of the key clinchers of combat. Flare utilisation and evasion. Whilst other ships could be used they don't really fit into the theme of SERCO nationalist. I would have to thank the many trainers in RED/BR1 not to mention individuals like spidey, Lisa and uncopan to whom offer constructive feed back post battle.

I still have a long way to go, having checked my account I have only logged 8 days total play time. To assume I have moved from noobian flight status with so little time would be laughable. Yet even my inexperience is raising eyebrows of some.

In any case I could easily install the game on my desktop which would vastly improve my combat prowess in terms of accuracy and movement. Though with any game I play I always like to make a name for myself (preferably a good one) so that I don't dissapear into the mass of users. My aim for this game is to establish myself as a worthwhile contender for PvP despite the fact I only use a phone.

From my PvP experience to date touchscreen combat struggles with accuracy, though its not really something that can be fixed. I remember playing an Xbox game that pit pc vs console in terms of fps. The mouse will always yield higher accuracy whilst a controller will offer more fluid movement. The touchscreen is basically a controller if setup in conjunction with droidbuttons. Though will have inherant sensitivity issues, such as forget fighting if you washed your hands or had a shower since you fingers won't register consistently.

There is another facet that a few have realised as a handicap of using a phone and without being too specific it falls into the movement bracket. To an extent this can be resolved via droidbuttons however the vastly improved sensitivity makes general flight near impossible. Fixing one shortcomming by creating another is no sufficient resolve.

One thing that I would like to see from a developmental view point. If you do relocate fire 2 a much welcomed replacement would be chat. Where you can select between channel/guild/group/sector much in the same way you can change between the other default buttons.

As you can see from my previous screenshot the alliance and group buttons allow me to talk at the four different chats, though as people will mention it still leads me to typing in the wrong channels. From the social aspect I think this is a definate for consideration.
Mar 17, 2013 TheRedSpy link
Ah I probably should have elaborated on that content, if it was not for the persistance of the members from RED I would be flying around in a swarm rag serving no other purpose than irritating people and depriving the exilliration of intense PvP dogfighting.

Oh that! hehe yes that took some convincing, but I'm glad you can now appreciate why we took the time to do that.

This ain't no newby half-trader spamrag-loving whiney itani nationalist guild, this is the Serco Military! Ho hah!

I mentioned to Akna earlier who is another new member on an android phone that we did indeed used to tell people that you probably won't really get anywhere in combat unless you have a computer - but we don't say that anymore since you've come along, so that is at the very least the beginning of your legacy.
Mar 17, 2013 Faille Corvelle link
KatoZee said "I still have a long way to go, having checked my account I have only logged 8 days total play time. To assume I have moved from noobian flight status with so little time would be laughable. Yet even my inexperience is raising eyebrows of some.

Like mine. I'm no combat newb, and you smashed me repeatedly. OK, it was a flare/gat SkyProm, but you still decidedly beat me. Only one fight was even close. Hell, I even saw you beat Espionages SkyProm. That takes some skill, even with a PC.

You have some mad phone skills.

Mar 17, 2013 Savet link
You never upset me. I gave you kudos. You fight very well. Once I got warmed up though, it was a different ballgame ;-)
Mar 18, 2013 KatoZee link
Perhaps, though at the same time you warmed up everyone else in the game must have at the same time. Didn't get a single kill that night... Though congratulations for defeating a new player.

Food for thought (^^,)

Its that aspect that made me chuckle, I was moaning to guildies that I was doing terrible that night, couldn't hit a station with a flare even if I was docked then you blurted out those lines which made me feel better.

Though not to detract from your combat ability you are decent pilot, though to bring topic back do you remember the names of the other phone users you've fought? Perhaps they could provide some insight into this thread? Or from a combat perspective anything you have noticed that would aide in phone users, you mentioned they don't fly like that which identifies a limitation to movement that could be resolved with your input.
Mar 18, 2013 Savet link
Often, even a slight change in confidence can make the difference. Believing something will work reduces second guesses. Ironically, I am on my phone right now...but I will try to give you the detailed feedback tonight when I get home.
Mar 19, 2013 abortretryfail link
Skill pffft... I could fly those with a joystick up me arse.

Do not be misled by this statement. Ballads are sung about the dexterity of spidey's arse.

I play on my tablet sometimes and the touchscreen controls aren't so bad there. On my phone they're just too tiny. Maybe it helps if you have smaller fingers?

The real gripe I have with the touchscreen controls is the lack of configurability and feature parity with the keyboard/mouse version. For example, without the touch UI, you can type during jumps and loading screens. The touch keyboard appears and disappears multiple times during jumps and loading screens and it eats whatever you were typing when it disappears. Extremely frustrating.

The devs have improved it a LOT though. Touch to target is *awesome* and the new long-press nav map and drag-and-drop features for ship loadouts are a godsend.
Mar 19, 2013 abortretryfail link
Yoda: Also I haven't got around to trying droid buttons yet, but it sounds like I should.
Yes you should. It adds a lot of much-needed configurability to the touchscreen which is otherwise set in stone. It's what makes it playable if you ask me. :)
Mar 19, 2013 KatoZee link
I've heard those drunken war songs in a few stations, didn't realise who they were about till now...

This is some useful stuff though I feel we would need to entice those from the trading/mining community to levy in their thoughts.

I don't think I could stomach mining and trading long enough to provide constructive feedback. If we could help resolve a lot of the issues it could potentially increase players from phones, the data costs are very reasonable to play wilst commuting too.

From an honest view point I almost quit vo when I first started, what was the point in playing if you were unable to compete in twitch based combat game. Though my thought process was that the developers didn't release it for android just to create easy targets, which lead to my research into droid buttons and finding an aim for playing this game.

Sounds weird granted getting an aim for a game but it's why we all play. Otherwise why keep playing if there is nothing what you want to achieve.

I wilI keep working on aspects to help with PvP combat with phone users, comparing notes with others to see if they are worth mention in this forum. The phone I believe will be the clincher as tablets won't suffer to drastically from button sizes.

Though i am struggling to find willing test subjects to shoot at during my time zone which is slowing development.
Mar 19, 2013 abortretryfail link
Targets need not always be willing. ;)
Mar 19, 2013 TheRedSpy link
he's flying a prom, not a valk :P
Mar 19, 2013 KatoZee link
Tis true about targets, though it tends to diminish results if they don't come at you in a prepared state. Plus its too much hassle chasing infini turbo volunteers.
Mar 19, 2013 Conflict Diamond link
/me is not sure if this thread should go under android or role-playing...

/me suggests a forum for role-playing androids
Mar 19, 2013 tarenty link
That suggestion belongs in the suggestion thread. :)